North Carolina Biotech Research Campus

[davidals]

^

I'm not as skeptical as Dan, and I really want to see this project succeed, but I can see his point(s). This is NOT just another suburban office park, or it shouldn't be, and that's not what it's supposed to be. The market should, and could, take care of high-end real estate needs and whims on its' own once the park is up and running - for this thing to succeed at all, other factors - like infrastructure, education of a workforce, education in general, attracting and incubating businesses, and maintaining what already exists in Kannapolis all should be higher priorities. I wouldn't argue that they aren't, but if this project has models, the model should be RTP (excluding the sprawl/subrubanization factor), not Ballantyne. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong on this, but if the ex-millworkers of Kannapolis can't afford million-dollar houses, neither can junior researchers, grad students and doctoral candidates - and those are the kind of folks who would be the foundation for a successful biotech complex (such people would be more likely to buy and renovate an old mill house, I'd imagine). The CEOs, start-up millionaires and senior researchers won't develop until later, which is why I think these exclusive developments are premature and perhaps a little antithetical to the needs of the project and the area.

And having this degenrate into just another office park wouldn't create a legacy for anyone, and Murdoch should know that.

[uptownliving]

The NC Research Campus is being built in downtown Kannapolis. It will not be an office park, but rather a town center. From an urban design standpoint it is the antithesis to RTP.

[davidals]

The NC Research Campus is being built in downtown Kannapolis. It will not be an office park, but rather a town center. From an urban design standpoint it is the antithesis to RTP.

This I know, and that wasn't my point. I wasn't referring to the urban design element [the "(excluding the sprawl/subrubanization factor)" qualifier in my previous post was an attempt at making this clear], but rather the demographic, scientific and educational component, and the dissonance between that component and these proposed $1-million real estate developments.

[uptownliving]

Oh, I agree with what you have posted...I think the million dollar home developments will not be occupied with people working at the NCRC...

These new million dollar home developments in Kannapolis will compete against the likes of Longview in Union County...I think you would have seen those coming regardless of the NCRC...but having the NCRC certainly doesn't hurt.

[DanRNC]

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong on this, but if the ex-millworkers of Kannapolis can't afford million-dollar houses, neither can junior researchers, grad students and doctoral candidates - and those are the kind of folks who would be the foundation for a successful biotech complex (such people would be more likely to buy and renovate an old mill house, I'd imagine).

True. UNC and NCSU will have approximately 6 full-time tenure-track faculty members with a median income of about $70K a year. I know UNC will also have an additional 12 non-tenure track faculty (working on soft money) which most likely will have incomes of $50-60K per year. On average those 6 tenure track faculty will have 3 grad students each making about $20K per year. Lab techs generally make $30-40K per year. Carolina North is facing this issue of providing affordable housing for faculty, students, staff, etc. A very interesting piece of data came out from surveys done regarding this matter, where most preferred NOT to live in close confines of the campus. A lot of the researchers said they preferred having substantial acreage on their property. They also stated they didn't want to live in a close community with co-workers-kind of the professional incestuous thing going on. Maybe this is one reason why NCSU's Centennial Campus residential component has been such a flop-and it was even very affordable. These are things that should have been taken into account through extensive research before this plan was thrown together.

[monsoon]

The campus is surrounded by mill houses that were built by Cannon Mills decades ago. It's actually fairly good development as it is a nice gridded network and a lot of it is within walking distance of the campus. There are also stores, a movie theatre, schools, grocery stores, restaurants, churches and a transit station. It has everything that a lot of cities aspire to be these days, even downtown Charlotte. However these are very modest homes and I know someone who bought one of these a 2-3 years ago for $35K! A steal in the Charlotte metro market for the most part.

Will these houses be flipped over to something more expensive? It's hard to say. On the earlier comment that people won't live near the campus that might be a good bet. NC Hwy 3, and Hwy 73 put Lake Norman within a 15 minute ride from there so I suspect that many may locate there.

[AuLukey]

You're right metro, Lake Norman is a close drive and this newest development is going to be on lakefront property (I believe it is Kannapolis Lake.) This may someday turn into Little Lake Norman.

While 35k is an amazingly good buy for this area. However, the lots the houses are located on are incredibly small and most of the houses are "fixer uppers" to say the very least. I had a friend of a friend who lived in one and we dropped by there on many occasions. While not "ghetto" by definition, it has a very "old school/next door neighbor watches your kids" feel to it. It's hard to describe that area. You really just have to see it for yourself.

[Miesian Corners]

I've been working on a research paper on the North Carolina Research Campus (NCRC) over the past couple of weeks. When you compare it to biotech parks elsewhere, it falls far short in many different ways.

First and foremost, there is the concept of clustering. Basically, clusters are related industries that operate as geographically concentrated collections of interrelated firms. They drive innovation and rely on human capital and tacit knowledge. Kannapolis has neither biotech human capital or a base of tacit knowledge.

All successful biotech parks are tied to the adjacency of large universities or related facilities. The immediate access of tacit knowledge is the primary asset of such parks. For the most part, tech parks exist because of research universities where knowledge was already available. Also, most parks offer big city amenities for workers (access to good schools, housing, entertainment, cultural opportunities, health care, scheduled air service, etc.). Again, Kannapolis has none of these.

Tacit knowledge requires face to face interaction. At the Virginia BioTechnology Park, VCU is next door, so is VCU Medical Center. At Louisiana's Intertech Science Park in Shreveport, there are three hospitals and the LSU Health Sciences Center all located within a half mile of each other that feed research at the park. RTP has direct access to three large universities--all within earshot of each other. Even though the UNC System has signed on as participants in Kannapolis, the core talent needed to maintain R&D will still be located 125 miles northeast of NCRC at Chapel Hill, Duke, and NC State. Since researchers need to interact with each other, a two hour drive to the Triangle does not equate to being able to run across campus. Further, Kannapolis has no knowledge-worker labor pool in which to pull from. What immediate gain would there be for a company to locate there if no human capital is available to serve their needs? While Charlotte's economy is rich with talent in financial services, it offers no talent in biotechnology--it's also nearly 30 miles away.

At best, NCRC will be marginally successful. I don't see major companies willing to risk not being able to find local talent. I also don't see them being able to attract talent from other high-amenity locations to move to Kannapolis. A single core laboratory is not enough to make the city suddenly attractive to the biotech industry when it can locate in other locations that offer large pools of knowledge workers who have contacts and are networked into a large research universities that are minutes, not hours away from their offices.

How'd I do, atlrvr?

[dubone]

Now we need to get Murdock to give another few billion to start up a major university nearby.

[monsoon]

Forgetting that UNCC has already announced a pretty large symbiotic facility just down the road from there, I think it is to early to say this project is going to fail as the are a significant number of related companies that are also relatively unknown to the forumers here who never venture out of the center of Charlotte. I personally know of several companies doing research on bio related plastics in Mooresville.

For example there was just this announcement just a couple of weeks ago from a Huntersville based company. Many would be surprised at how many places like this exist throughout N. Mecklenburg, S. Iredell and Cabarrus county. I think it is a bad assumption to believe this area is just financial services. Murdock probably knows this and I would give him a bit more credit for not throwing away a billion dollars on nothing.

I only say this because you posted your ideas for a paper here and I assume wanted input.

[DanRNC]

Miesian, you hit the nail on the head. I know from living in Charlotte prior to 2000 that they are really no jobs in the biotech sector. The NC Biotech Center lists 33 (including some bio investment firms) in the Charlotte area and most of those are very small. This means all talent needs to be trained from scratch and most talent will need to be imported-an almost impossible task.

This plan was a hastily thrown together gamish by Murdock and that lame brain Molly Broad (defunct UNC President). There were no feasability studies or long-range planning. She said she liked his drawings (Murdock's) and thats how this started. Unfortunately the UNC system signed on for non-negotiable leases of $6 million per year under Broad and state rubber stamped it without any review because of the promise of employing all the former Pillowtex workers.

[MZT]

RTP sat empty for something like 10 years before any companies moved into it. So I think it will take quite a while to decide if this venture "worked out". There may be more companies than we think, interested in locating in a low cost-of-living area like Kannapolis.

[Miesian Corners]

^Again, it has nothing to do with cost of living or the cost of doing business. From what I can find, it is all about human capital. If you don't have access to people that have the knowledge to work in such high tech jobs, then no company will build any serious stuff there. Back office, sure. Real R&D, probably not.

[monsoon]

^Again, it has nothing to do with cost of living or the cost of doing business. From what I can find, it is all about human capital. If you don't have access to people that have the knowledge to work in such high tech jobs, then no company will build any serious stuff there. Back office, sure. Real R&D, probably not.

I wonder what led IBM to build its largest research and development campus in the world in Raleigh if that was the case? When they did this, the state was basically known for tobacco, furniture, and textiles. Not exactly the stuff of computer, mechanical, electrical, and chemical engineers. They later repeated this act in Charlotte in the 1970s and hired thousands of engineers and researchers to develop printers. This later was spun off into an independant company. Maybe you have heard of it, lexmark.

It's an interesting theory, but one not born out by reality.

[DanRNC]

I wonder what led IBM to build its largest research and development campus in the world in Raleigh if that was the case? When they did this, the state was basically known for tobacco, furniture, and textiles.

The RTP region at that time still had 3 major universities with advanced mathematics programs, physics programs, and NCSU and Duke had engineering programs. The Triangle was already a burgeoning intellectual center. It was never really that reliant on textiles or maufacturing-that was always Charlotte and Greensboro.

Miesian is right in saying that companies' main focus is tapping an established, talented, and educated work force when deciding to relocate, especially now with tight competition for brain power jobs. Its no secret why the centers of these industries are in the Bay area, Boston, RTP, Seattle, Austin etc. and why they aren't in Montana, Idaho where those state governements hava ehad strategic plans/investments for years to recruit biotech businesses. To get into the biotech game now is about 20 years behind the curve.

[monsoon]

IBM did not staff their Charlotte and RTP campuses because of the local schools. They brought in a huge number of experience people from the outside. You can't build a research and development facility with new hires from college. Of course they hire people from these schools but they hire nationally so that part is basically irrelevant.

The reason IBM went to RTP was because of the tax advantages the state offered in the creation of RTP. This was a financial inducement for them to build a research and development center there. The same will hold true for Kannapolis. Money will bring people in and I feel this will be a successful endeavor as the original wave of high tech was decades ago.

[uptownliving]

I stopped by Kannapolis on my way home this Sunday and took a few pics of the progress at the NCRC:

This gives you an idea of just how large the site is. And this pic only gets about 20% of the site in the frame.

The Core Lab building is adjacent to the existing Cannon Village which is basically downtown Kannapolis. From an urban design perspective you can't get much better than this.

Just a block from the Core Lab is this gem. It is still in use and about 10 min after this pic was taken there was a line out the door to go see Santa Clause 3.

And here is the Core Lab building. Notice how close it is to the train tracks. The Amtrak station is just 2 blocks down the street.

[voyager12]

It all looks absolutely fantastic Thanks for the pics!

[monsoon]

This really is a great area in the metro. It always surprises me on how many people that I mention this place too, have never been there.

[voyager12]

I have never been there. I did not realize how integrated the campus is with downtown KPS. It really looks impressive. Will have to take a Sunday drive sometime myself....if I knew how to get there

[Neo]

I have never been there. I did not realize how integrated the campus is with downtown KPS. It really looks impressive. Will have to take a Sunday drive sometime myself....if I knew how to get there

Google can be your best friend:

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&hl=en&...558929&om=1

[49er]

we bought furniture a few months ago from one of the many dealers in downtown. if you stop by the visitors center and check out the history, its interesting to see how downtown is in effect, a disneyland sort of front. it was a turn of the 20th century birkdale village built from scratch to create a downtown for the burgeoning mill village. Careful planning, good architecture and time have made it look authentic. After its heyday, it was for years the place to go to buy towels & linens etc from cannon mills. it has transitioned now to being a sort of giant furniture mall. a nice church at the terminus of the main street gives it the feel of a small new england town.

oh yeah, and its also worth a visit to see the NINE FOOT TALL Dale Earnhardt statue in a downtown park there.

[jednc]

I've been working on a research paper on the North Carolina Research Campus (NCRC) over the past couple of weeks. When you compare it to biotech parks elsewhere, it falls far short in many different ways.

First and foremost, there is the concept of clustering. Basically, clusters are related industries that operate as geographically concentrated collections of interrelated firms. They drive innovation and rely on human capital and tacit knowledge. Kannapolis has neither biotech human capital or a base of tacit knowledge.

All successful biotech parks are tied to the adjacency of large universities or related facilities. The immediate access of tacit knowledge is the primary asset of such parks. For the most part, tech parks exist because of research universities where knowledge was already available. Also, most parks offer big city amenities for workers (access to good schools, housing, entertainment, cultural opportunities, health care, scheduled air service, etc.). Again, Kannapolis has none of these.

Tacit knowledge requires face to face interaction. At the Virginia BioTechnology Park, VCU is next door, so is VCU Medical Center. At Louisiana's Intertech Science Park in Shreveport, there are three hospitals and the LSU Health Sciences Center all located within a half mile of each other that feed research at the park. RTP has direct access to three large universities--all within earshot of each other. Even though the UNC System has signed on as participants in Kannapolis, the core talent needed to maintain R&D will still be located 125 miles northeast of NCRC at Chapel Hill, Duke, and NC State. Since researchers need to interact with each other, a two hour drive to the Triangle does not equate to being able to run across campus. Further, Kannapolis has no knowledge-worker labor pool in which to pull from. What immediate gain would there be for a company to locate there if no human capital is available to serve their needs? While Charlotte's economy is rich with talent in financial services, it offers no talent in biotechnology--it's also nearly 30 miles away.

At best, NCRC will be marginally successful. I don't see major companies willing to risk not being able to find local talent. I also don't see them being able to attract talent from other high-amenity locations to move to Kannapolis. A single core laboratory is not enough to make the city suddenly attractive to the biotech industry when it can locate in other locations that offer large pools of knowledge workers who have contacts and are networked into a large research universities that are minutes, not hours away from their offices.

How'd I do, atlrvr?

Gee, if only there were a medium where scientists, or even the general population, could communicate through video, audio, written word, pictures, or spoken word instantly over long distances. Perhaps we could get Al Gore to start working on this problem?

[voyager12]

Thank you Neo! The wonders of technology.....

[ElricSeven]

Forgetting that UNCC has already announced a pretty large symbiotic facility just down the road from there, I think it is to early to say this project is going to fail as the are a significant number of related companies that are also relatively unknown to the forumers here who never venture out of the center of Charlotte. I personally know of several companies doing research on bio related plastics in Mooresville.

For example there was just this announcement just a couple of weeks ago from a Huntersville based company. Many would be surprised at how many places like this exist throughout N. Mecklenburg, S. Iredell and Cabarrus county. I think it is a bad assumption to believe this area is just financial services. Murdock probably knows this and I would give him a bit more credit for not throwing away a billion dollars on nothing.

I only say this because you posted your ideas for a paper here and I assume wanted input.

He's right, I'm heavily involved in this stuff and there's a lot of things going on here that y'all don't know about because it gets no publicity. While no guarantee, there have been some real signs that this place might take off like a rocket ship. The Kannapolis campus and UNCC are starting to have some success in recruiting companies doing translational research. We've also a very dynamic group of hospitals doing much more research (due to the lack of a medical school) by themselves and with significant NIH and other funding. Our patient population base for performing clinical studies is incredible by any measure. Right now, Duke, Wake and UNC Chapel Hill come here to do a lot of their clinical trials. $200 million venture fund doesn't hurt and we're also perceived outside of the Southeast as being pretty much in the same location as RTP.

It would pay to wait and see on this one. The next year will be very telling.