Tallahassee Regional Airport

[Glenn]

Let's all complete this new survey for our airport. http://talgov.com/airport/survey3.cfm

Airport Launches Online Survey

February 7

Tallahassee Regional Partners With FAMU and Local Chambers - Today the Tallahassee Regional Airport posted a survey on the City of Tallahassee's Talgov.com website to solicit feedback from the business community and interested travelers regarding the potential development of a business center at the Airport. The survey, created in partnership with Florida A&M University's (FAMU) School of Business and Industry, will gather data regarding traveler's anticipated support of the business center, types of desired amenities and identify scenarios that would encourage local membership.

"The Airport is pleased to offer the FAMU students an opportunity to gain real world experience in their chosen field and to support higher education in the Tallahassee community. This is a real plus, certainly for Tallahassee Regional but also for the students as well," said Victoria Maleszewski, the Airport's Acting Business Services Manager. The survey's target audience was solicited in cooperation with the Greater Tallahassee Chamber of Commerce and Economic Development Council of Tallahassee/Leon County, Inc., the Tallahassee Area Convention & Visitors Bureau and the Capital City Chamber of Commerce.

"Partnering with the Tallahassee Regional Airport on this project has enabled five of my students, including two recent graduates, to gain valuable real world market research experience that they can add to their resumes and speak about as they seek permanent employment," commented Dr. Shawnta Friday-Stroud, Professor of Management and Acting Chair for the Management and Marketing Department at FAMU. The Airport pledged a $10,000 stipend to FAMU to compensate students for deliverables.

Survey results will be collected through Feb. 23. Students will issue a final survey report to Airport staff, which will review the survey results as part of the prospective development of the Business Center. For more information regarding the survey or the prospective Airport business center, please visit Talgov.com or contact Victoria Maleszewski at 891-7802.

[SkyDave]

Done!

[Florida]

Done!

[blueheronNC]

Delta just loaded their summer schedule to the reservation system, and Tallahassee goes down to just ONE mainline flight per day. The schedule is as follows:

6:15am - Flt. 4110 - CRJ700

7:55am - Flt. 489 - MD88

9:15am - Flt. 4198 - CRJ

11am - Flt. 4210 - CRJ

12:50pm - Flt. 5966 - EMB-145

1:50pm - Flt.4868 - CRJ

3:00pm - Flt.4212 - CRJ

4:30pm - Flt. 4228 - CRJ

6:20pm - Flt. 4240 - CRJ

Bringing a total of just one mainline flight per day in TLH, all airlines included. Meaning the lowest amount of mainline jet service in the entire history of Tallahassee's airport since the advent of jet (as opposed to turboprop.) aircraft.

Sad.

[psycuda]

Delta just loaded their summer schedule to the reservation system, and Tallahassee goes down to just ONE mainline flight per day. The schedule is as follows:

6:15am - Flt. 4110 - CRJ700

7:55am - Flt. 489 - MD88

9:15am - Flt. 4198 - CRJ

11am - Flt. 4210 - CRJ

12:50pm - Flt. 5966 - EMB-145

1:50pm - Flt.4868 - CRJ

3:00pm - Flt.4212 - CRJ

4:30pm - Flt. 4228 - CRJ

6:20pm - Flt. 4240 - CRJ

Bringing a total of just one mainline flight per day in TLH, all airlines included. Meaning the lowest amount of mainline jet service in the entire history of Tallahassee's airport since the advent of jet (as opposed to turboprop.) aircraft.

Sad.

Looks line no more leaving Rochester at 4 to get back here.

[blueheronNC]

Looks line no more leaving Rochester at 4 to get back here.

Those are the flights departing Tallahassee going to Atlanta. You'll still have a 7:25 p.m. flight (MD88) and 10:35 p.m. (CRJ700) out of Atlanta. Being 6'3", I refuse to fly regional jets, so looks like my travel times to Tallahassee from Raleigh/Durham are pretty set in stone.

Oh, and to compare other "competing" cities - Pensacola (PNS) will be all mainline Delta to Atlanta (7x daily, 6 MD88 and 1 757). It wasn't that long ago when TLH and PNS were about on par with passenger statistics, and now PNS has a ton more mainline than we do.

As for Fort Walton Beach (VPS), they'll have one MD88, 4 CRJ700, and 3 CRJ, meaning their daily capacity to Atlanta will be greater than TLH.

[Glenn]

Very Sad, Baffling & down right Pitiful for our Capital City! Looks like I'll be doing quite a bit more driving...Unfortunately.

[Monticello-1827]

excuse my ignorance, but what is a "main line" flight? thanks in advance!

[blueheronNC]

excuse my ignorance, but what is a "main line" flight? thanks in advance!

A mainline flight is a flight operated by the parent airline and not one of its "express" or "connection" carriers. More importantly, a mainline flight is flown by a "regular" as opposed to a "regional jet." Jet aircraft are divided into those two categories. A regional jet is much smaller...tighter legroom, narrow aisles, and less than 6 feet of vertical clearance (I basically have to bend over in these planes...can't stand up straight). Specifically, Delta's MD88 into Tallahassee holds 148 passengers. Delta's CRJ into Tallahassee holds 50 passengers. Two years ago, we had 8x MD88 per day. Now we have one. A huge decrease in available seats.

Perhaps a visual is the best way to depict the difference:

Mainline (MD88) interior - http://www.airliners.net/open.file/1133477/L/

Regional jet (CRJ) - http://www.airliners.net/open.file/1080816/L/

[poonther]

Not good news at all.

However I do wonder how much this has to do w/a seasonal change? While the summer is a huge flying time historically, for TLH the numbers in the summer don't change much. At PNS and VPS especially, I'm sure the numbers go up greatly b/c of the beaches and the high season for tourist. Kudos to PNS for expanding so much. I think once they got AirTran and held on to it (in their area it was at MOB first, the VPS and now PNS) it made a huge difference in their airport loads.

Being 5'7", CRJ's don't bother me one bit especially for the 35 minutes you are in the air to ATL. Also as one who flies but doesn't really like it, most of the times the take-offs and landings feel smoother to me on the CRJ's which correctly or incorrectly comforts me.

I really like the CRJ700's which hold a few more people than the CRJ100. But I do not like the EMB 145 and will try to avoid that flight.

Here's the breakdown when I ran the numbers over at Delta:

For a Monday flight to and from TLH to ATL this APRIL they run 7 flights daily. 1 CRJ (50 seats), 3 MD-88 (142 seats/mainline), 1 EMB145 (50 seats), 1 CRJ700 (70 seats) and 1 737-800 (150 seats/mainline) for a total of 746 seats (if my math is correct)

Now for Monday flights to and from TLH to ATL this JULY they will run 9 flights daily which you could look at as a positive b/c it could make your lay-over in ATL a little shorter or if you miss your flight, a new connecting flight will come along sooner, but of course being a smaller plane it's more likely to be full. Anyway here's the breakdown of those 9 flights: 1 CRJ700 (70 seats) 1 MD-88 (142 seats/mainline) 6 CRJ (50 seats) and 1 EMB145 (50 seats) for a total of 562 seats. So w/this summer change TLH will lose 184 seats daily....again if my math is correct.

I think 2 years and more ago when Delta was flying all the MD-88's in here was b/c AirTran was flying their big jets here. This IMHO was part of Delta's "trick" to handle that competition and as we all know, it worked and now once they successfully did that, they raised fares and lowered seating capacity.

On a positive note, we do keep our 3 daily flights on the same type of aircraft (EMB-145) to and from the following in-state locations: MCO, TPA, FLL and MIA.

And what all this really says to me.....I'll continue to fly out of TLH, but I'll do my best to avoid Delta. I can use Continental via Houston for west coast flights and USAir via CLT to Northeast trips.

[SkyDave]

However I do wonder how much this has to do w/a seasonal change? While the summer is a huge flying time historically, for TLH the numbers in the summer don't change much. At PNS and VPS especially, I'm sure the numbers go up greatly b/c of the beaches and the high season for tourist. Kudos to PNS for expanding so much. I think once they got AirTran and held on to it (in their area it was at MOB first, the VPS and now PNS) it made a huge difference in their airport loads.

Being 5'7", CRJ's don't bother me one bit especially for the 35 minutes you are in the air to ATL. Also as one who flies but doesn't really like it, most of the times the take-offs and landings feel smoother to me on the CRJ's which correctly or incorrectly comforts me.

I really like the CRJ700's which hold a few more people than the CRJ100. But I do not like the EMB 145 and will try to avoid that flight.

I agree Poonther!

Tallahassee is not a tourist destination. It makes good business sense to move your capacity to those areas where tourism and summer traffic is high. There maybe one more silver lining to this, it levels the playing field for the other carriers. Passengers will be more willing to choose US Airways, Continental, and NWA. There will be no compelling reason to go through the mess in Atlanta anymore due to larger jets.

Competitively speaking it maybe the godsend we've been waiting for. It may open the door for United Express and/or American Eagle to come to Tallahassee. The more competition the better!

My preferences are as follows, if going east and north I use US Airways. If going West or Northwest, I use Continental or NWA. I avoid Delta like the plague.

[blueheronNC]

There maybe one more silver lining to this, it levels the playing field for the other carriers. Passengers will be more willing to choose US Airways, Continental, and NWA. There will be no compelling reason to go through the mess in Atlanta anymore due to larger jets.

If that ends up being the result, that would be great. One of the main reasons of my continued patronization of Delta into and out of Tallahassee was to incentivize the continuation of larger jets into Tallahassee. Apparently that didn't work. However, for West Coast destinations, I bit the bullet and flew Continental Express through Houston on regional jets in order to help keep competition robust. Anyway, from Raleigh it now makes no sense for me to choose Delta over US Airways Express through Charlotte (Charlotte airport is much prettier anyway and there's a great BBQ place AND a Jamba Juice there in the airport). So yeah, this may end up helping if passengers begin to figure out that *gasp* other airlines besides Delta fly into Tallahassee.

[poonther]

Jamba Juice at CLT...I've been missing that. When did it arrive and more importantly where is it please??

[blueheronNC]

Jamba Juice at CLT...I've been missing that. When did it arrive and more importantly where is it please??

Walking from that main skylight/glass atrium area through the connector to concourses D/E, on the left side in that connector. Having lived in CA for five years enjoying Jamba Juice nearly every day, I was floored seeing one in Charlotte of all places. Since US Airways Express occupies Concourse E, if you're connecting to domestic mainline (occupying mostly B and C), you'd most likely pass it.

It's one of only two Jamba Juices in the entire state of NC (the other being in the food court on UNC's campus - I think it's there because the CEO of the company attended UNC business school).

[poonther]

^Thank you very much for the info. I know exactly the area you are talking about and will keep me eyes open for it the next time. Usually I have to get my JJ fix when I travel back to SFL. CA is also where long ago I got my JJ obsession..."Mango Mantra w/a energy boost please"....when visiting relatives out there for long periods of time, JJ seemed to be on every corner. Where in CA did you live and was that before or after you time in Tally?

[blueheronNC]

^Thank you very much for the info. I know exactly the area you are talking about and will keep me eyes open for it the next time. Usually I have to get my JJ fix when I travel back to SFL. CA is also where long ago I got my JJ obsession..."Mango Mantra w/a energy boost please"....when visiting relatives out there for long periods of time, JJ seemed to be on every corner. Where in CA did you live and was that before or after you time in Tally?

Lived in the San Fran. Bay Area after spending the first 18 years of my life in Tallahassee. I'm partial to the Citrus Squeeze with Vita Boost.

[Go Gators]

Its frustrating, I was just reading in Kiplinger's Personal Finance how nation wide flight prices have been steadily decreasing as the low cost carriers continue to gain market share against the "big guns." I dont care about my income, its more about principal, but I refuse to pay 250-300$ to take an hour to flight to Orlando, Tampa, Atlanta, etc, when I can drive there signifcantly cheaper. If Im flying somewhere else, I drive to fly out of another airport.

Until our leaders in this city make an honest effort to lure a viable low cost alternative to Delta, people arent going to flock to TLH. I dont believe more people using the airport will bring more choices to the people. I believe more choices for the people will bring more people to the airport.

[Florida]

Its frustrating, I was just reading in Kiplinger's Personal Finance how nation wide flight prices have been steadily decreasing as the low cost carriers continue to gain market share against the "big guns." I dont care about my income, its more about principal, but I refuse to pay 250-300$ to take an hour to flight to Orlando, Tampa, Atlanta, etc, when I can drive there signifcantly cheaper. If Im flying somewhere else, I drive to fly out of another airport.

Until our leaders in this city make an honest effort to lure a viable low cost alternative to Delta, people arent going to flock to TLH. I dont believe more people using the airport will bring more choices to the people. I believe more choices for the people will bring more people to the airport.

GG, what do you call $3 million dollars worth of subsidies to AirTran. They had a decent market share in this area and just pulled the plug on us without much discussion and without a very good excuse. The city has and continues to try to lure a discount carrier. I specifically asked Michael Wright (Assistant City Manager over Airport Operations, Economic Development, StarMetro...etc) about Southwest Airline and he told me they like second tier markets and I'm afriad Tallahassee is a III Tier, thanks to virtually no population outside Leon County's boundaries in the surrounding counties to boost the metro's numbers.

I'd like to see a little shake up at the airport. Someone should be held accountable for the decline in passenger traffic since the departure of Mayor Maddox.

[SkyDave]

I'd like to see a little shake up at the airport. Someone should be held accountable for the decline in passenger traffic since the departure of Mayor Maddox.

I agree TJ, we need a rah rah person/leadership team at the airport. We need someone who is willing to confront the city commission about an independent web site. Finally, we need some one who will lobby the city and use the airport fees for marketing dollars to be utilized by the airport throughout the region. The region being defined as all of North Florida and South Georgia pop. 750,000.

[Florida]

I agree TJ, we need a rah rah person/leadership team at the airport. We need someone who is willing to confront the city commission about an independent web site. Finally, we need some one who will lobby the city and use the airport fees for marketing dollars to be utilized by the airport throughout the region. The region being defined as all of North Florida and South Georgia pop. 750,000.

I feel the energy in your statement and I'm with you. Much the same way the city hired Ron Garrison to lead the tranist into the future, they probably need another "Ron Garrison" for the Airport. The city manager likes to take her time with staff changes, but this is something I thinks she should show some priority. We need to light a fire under Tallahassee before we loose our grip on this region and become known as one of the cities the Panama City Airport serves.

[SkyDave]

I'll mail Ken Austin this weekend. He's our Airport Administrator, and a friend.

TJ, were you able to get with Mr. Austin and address some of the forum's opinions and concerns? If so, what kind of response did he give if any?????

[Go Gators]

GG, what do you call $3 million dollars worth of subsidies to AirTran. They had a decent market share in this area and just pulled the plug on us without much discussion and without a very good excuse. The city has and continues to try to lure a discount carrier. I specifically asked Michael Wright (Assistant City Manager over Airport Operations, Economic Development, StarMetro...etc) about Southwest Airline and he told me they like second tier markets and I'm afriad Tallahassee is a III Tier, thanks to virtually no population outside Leon County's boundaries in the surrounding counties to boost the metro's numbers.

I'd like to see a little shake up at the airport. Someone should be held accountable for the decline in passenger traffic since the departure of Mayor Maddox.

Thats interesting. The way I understood it was that one AirTran was here and began beating Delta's fares, Delta began cutting their fares as well. Then, when people were given the choice to fly AirTran (former ValuJet) or Delta, they chose the more established Delta. This eventually drove AirTran out of the market. Im totally against regulation, but think its in bad form for Delta to lower rates to beat someone out of the market, then jack prices up again once they leave.

[poonther]

Until our leaders in this city make an honest effort to lure a viable low cost alternative to Delta, people arent going to flock to TLH. I dont believe more people using the airport will bring more choices to the people. I believe more choices for the people will bring more people to the airport.

I agree w/this statement and the numbers prove it when AirTran was here.

As for Delta lowering their prices AFTER AirTran arrived, that's not exactly how it happened. When AirTran announced service would begin, I believe it was on Nov. 15th, I looked up a fare on Delta for that year on Nov. 14th. Well that fare was in the upper $200's. Guess what the fare was on 11.15 and beyond....it magically dropped to $150ish dollars. The same story happened the day after AirTran left the market and the fare to ATL almost doubled.

Some of you have posted this idea before, but I agree it's time for a change in all those running the airport, from the City appointed management to the advisory board. We need aggressive and innovative folks running this place and I don't think that's exactly what we've got out there now?????

[Monticello-1827]

Im totally against regulation, but think its in bad form for Delta to lower rates to beat someone out of the market, then jack prices up again once they leave.

what you said is true and as long as capitalism (best economic system around) prevails this is a viable market strategy to force competition out. the sad truth is that tallahassee is a market that has to be happy about what it gets concerning air service rather than be able to dictate the terms and lure discount carriers. i do not think the basic economics of the airport will change unless our population explodes and it's moved to a more convenience location. (so people outside leon county could access it more easily.)

[SkyDave]

On the COT website for the airport, it states that Tallahassee Regional Airport is THE airport of record serving an area within a 100 mile radius of Tallahassee. That's well over 750,000 folks. The truth is that this airport is underutilized because of a lack of vision and leadership. There is NO Regional Marketing, NO Regional Outreach, No Regional Identity, and NO Regional Web Site!!!! It seems they are doing everything possible to manifest the parochial attitudes of the No-Growth forces in Tallahassee.

Sorry for the rant!!!!