The Coronavirus thread

[elrodvt]

On the newshour tonight they had a segment about how 60% (don't quote me on the numbers) of conservatives don't believe this is a crisis while libs are the reverse. So, can one really be apolitical on this topic? I like to think by reading the WashPo and watching the pbs news I get my news education as balanced as possible. Maybe not though....

So, when you see the white house changing the story all the time, while getting closer to what the experts in the admin have been saying for quite a while now, how's that looked at by the conservative press and Fox news? I don't mean Fox commentators, who strike me as a rabid bunch, but their actual news coverage. BTW, I think CNN/msnbc are almost as rabbid.

In any case, the point of the segment was during previous crisis the country pulled together but not this time. Leadership issue in my opinion but based on the frowns a lot of folks would not agree. So why then?

[urbanlover568]

13 minutes ago, elrodvt said:

On the newshour tonight they had a segment about how 60% (don't quote me on the numbers) of conservatives don't believe this is a crisis while libs are the reverse. So, can one really be apolitical on this topic? I like to think by reading the WashPo and watching the pbs news I get my news education as balanced as possible. Maybe not though....

So, when you see the white house changing the story all the time, while getting closer to what the experts in the admin have been saying for quite a while now, how's that looked at by the conservative press and Fox news? I don't mean Fox commentators, who strike me as a rabid bunch, but their actual news coverage. BTW, I think CNN/msnbc are almost as rabbid.

In any case, the point of the segment was during previous crisis the country pulled together but not this time. Leadership issue in my opinion but based on the frowns a lot of folks would not agree. So why then?

We get it, you think it's a hoax and think it's a "lib" conspiracy. Really crazy how people think a group of people are excited about this or get pleasure in people dying.

[elrodvt]

∆I assume that was a joke?

I have no idea how you came up with the crazy comment though. I sure don't know anyone with an attitude like that. I hope no one does.

It's a matter of degree though. Minimizing the risk at every turn was, until today really, the admins position. Perhaps the argument is that this stops a panic but going against your own experts can't make sense can it?  All it will do is stretch things out and increase deaths.

Trying to understand not hurt anybody's feelings as yours evidently were. I did see a comment that the difference may be more rural vs. cities as opposed to party affiliation. I guess if I lived in some remote Montana enclave I might think it was no big deal too. 

I bet some of those silicon valley guys are hunkered down in their missile silo's right now. hope they remembered their toilet paper.

[urbanlover568]

6 minutes ago, elrodvt said:

∆I assume that was a joke?

I have no idea how you came up with the crazy comment though. I sure don't know anyone with an attitude like that. I hope no one does.

It's a matter of degree though. Minimizing the risk at every turn was, until today really, the admins position. Perhaps the argument is that this stops a panic but going against your own experts can't make sense can it?  All it will do is stretch things out and increase deaths.

Trying to understand not hurt anybody's feelings as yours evidently were. I did see a comment that the difference may be more rural vs. cities as opposed to party affiliation. I guess if I lived in some remote Montana enclave I might think it was no big deal too. 

I bet some of those silicon valley guys are hunkered down in their missile silo's right now. hope they remembered their toilet paper.

I will say that nothing is funny or enjoyable about this. Hundreds are dying painful deaths daily and thousands are being laid off. What scares me the most is when the anti-vaxxers resurge and spread misinformation about this.

[elrodvt]

1 hour ago, urbanlover568 said:

I will say that nothing is funny or enjoyable about this. Hundreds are dying painful deaths daily and thousands are being laid off. What scares me the most is when the anti-vaxxers resurge and spread misinformation about this.

Agreed! 

I read somewhere that unknown foreign bots are hitting Facebook to say the crisis overblown. Some social media censorship from Facebook may eventually have to be implemented temporarily. If they say they cannot. Boom no more vpn nor non USA posts. That's simple enough that even they can't worm out of it.

The anti science / anti vaxxer folks are especially scary and impossible for to understand. I've never understood why a child without proper immunization is allowed to go to public or charter schools. Seems insane. You don't want to vax then home school or use a private academy. Plus no gatherings of over 10 forever. Tough crap about your taxes being "wasted". A lot of people with no kids pay those same taxes. Violate and you become monitored by your state health department.  Hey! Maybe something good could come out of this??

Edited March 17, 2020 by elrodvt

[gman430]

I just don’t understand why we didn’t have this mass hysteria going on when H1N1 was occurring in 2009. It does seem like at least in my opinion that the media has an agenda going on right now. Notice it’s an election year.  If everybody would turn off the media for a few days nobody would even notice there a virus  was going around and the economy would be booming again. Oh and the flu kills far more people every year but nobody is freaking out over that while raiding the toilet paper aisle at the grocery store. 

 

Edited March 17, 2020 by gman430

[southslider]

I don't recall H1N1 resulting in mass-scale triaging at ICUs.  Our own government denied access to WHO test kits for months.  Cruises were still happening less than a week ago. St Patrick's Day must now be observed at home. Or we will make Italy look mild in comparison. 

[gman430]

Still waiting on the panic and mass hysteria over the flu which kills far more people every year. And why in the world does New Jersey have a curfew? Does this virus attack at night or something? Is it Batman? 

By the way, they can hoot and holler “stay in your homes” all they want but until they start paying my check and bills or force me to stay at home through some sort of curfew/shelter in place, that’s not going to happen. I have to go to work everyday. My employer won’t let me off for this. 

[49er]

This has zero to do with the election this year. Most of the planet is dealing with and reacting to this virus in a similar manner. Except the UK, they don't seem to know what they're doing! 

[TCLT]

8 hours ago, gman430 said:

I just don’t understand why we didn’t have this mass hysteria going on when H1N1 was occurring in 2009. It does seem like at least in my opinion that the media has an agenda going on right now. Notice it’s an election year.  If everybody would turn off the media for a few days nobody would even notice there a virus  was going around and the economy would be booming again. Oh and the flu kills far more people every year but nobody is freaking out over that while raiding the toilet paper aisle at the grocery store. 

 

An entire province in China has been on lockdown for more than 3 months. The entirety of Italy and Spain are shutdown. Countries in Africa, Central America, and South America have closed their borders. But sure, this is all just a panic drummed up by the US media to hurt Trump's reelection chances. Jfc.

[urbanlover568]

2 hours ago, gman430 said:

Still waiting on the panic and mass hysteria over the flu which kills far more people every year. And why in the world does New Jersey have a curfew? Does this virus attack at night or something? Is it Batman? 

By the way, they can hoot and holler “stay in your homes” all they want but until they start paying my check and bills or force me to stay at home through some sort of curfew/shelter in place, that’s not going to happen. I have to go to work everyday. My employer won’t let me off for this. 

You do realize 20 percent of the folks who get this have to go to the hospital and 3.8 percent die right? This disinformation campaign you are spreading is dangerous is the main reason counties didn't take it seriously in the beginning. Italy is making life and death decisions on who they treat now and running out of supplies. I would not be able to sleep at night being a accomplice to that disinformation campaign. 

[videtur quam contuor]

"To summarize, COVID-19 spreads less efficiently than flu, transmission does not appear to be driven by people who are not sick, it causes more severe illness than flu, there are not yet any vaccines or therapeutics, and it can be contained – which is why we must do everything we can to contain it. That’s why WHO recommends a comprehensive approach.

These differences mean we can’t treat COVID-19 exactly the same way we treat flu."

 

This summary is from a longer article from WHO Director General statement earlier this month. More fatalities, no prior protection nor vaccine, risk of health system overload is real. These are realities. Read statement below.

https://www.who.int/dg/speeches/detail/who-director-general-s-opening-remarks-at-the-media-briefing-on-covid-19---3-march-2020

[tozmervo]

Most data points to Corona spreading because carriers are asymptomatic. With the flu, people stay home because they generally know they are sick.  Most data points to a much higher mortality rate for the elderly population. Corona is also causing a far far higher rate of hospitalization than seasonal flu, requiring serious treatment for respiratory conditions. Basically we don't have enough hospital beds.

Based on the demographic data available, and given the lack of vaccine (which we have for the flu), if the same number of people contract Corona as get the seasonal flu then we're seeing a death toll of around 1.5 million. And the scary thing is that it appears to be far more contagious than seasonal flu. 

The frustrating thing is that so many people will see a low death toll and think, "well that was a waste and this was all overblown," when in fact a low death toll would be a remarkable sign of success.

 

Edited March 17, 2020 by tozmervo

[kermit]

After having spoken with a particularly militant 19 year old I am starting to think that Corona denial (e.g. still going out and doing stuff) amongst the young is not much different than climate change denial amongst the old. Events that are perceived to have little direct impact on a cohort tend to get ignored by that group.

Too bad the gen Xers cant stage a large group gathering to hash out some of these existential  conflicts....

Edited March 17, 2020 by kermit

[JHart]

Also the higher total deaths (so far) from the regular flu should mean the opposite of 'we don't need to worry about this strain'; it means the US needs to get up to the same level as the rest of the developed world when it comes to paid sick leave, affordable healthcare, and vaccination rates..

[elrodvt]

3 hours ago, gman430 said:

Still waiting on the panic and mass hysteria over the flu which kills far more people every year. And why in the world does New Jersey have a curfew? Does this virus attack at night or something? Is it Batman? 

By the way, they can hoot and holler “stay in your homes” all they want but until they start paying my check and bills or force me to stay at home through some sort of curfew/shelter in place, that’s not going to happen. I have to go to work everyday. My employer won’t let me off for this. 

I don't understand where people get this stuff. Why would you listen to anyone but WHO, CDC or leading university thinkers in the field?

Serious question,  What news group gives folks this perspective??

Regarding night time curfew sounds like that is for folks who won't listen and are likely get belligerent after hours of drinking. Just makes it easier to manage.

Here is the actual text and note there is no curfew but a recommendation driven by people who won't listen for the public good.

https://www.nj.com/coronavirus/2020/03/gov-murphy-asks-for-statewide-curfew-in-new-jersey-amid-coronavirus-outbreak.html

 

If your employer thinks they can skirt what will soon be NC law as well then i guess they are rushing toward a rude awakening. I really sympathize with people working for someone like that. Personally I would first take care of people companies have to cut for financial reasons and then the employers so they can come back to something. An employer like that might find themselves ineligible for whatever is passed to help out companies.

 

[TCLT]

NC restaurants and bars to be ordered to close today, effective 5pm. Take out and delivery orders will still be permitted. Governor Cooper doing his part to affect the election.

Edited March 17, 2020 by TCLT
for ubanlover568

[urbanlover568]

3 minutes ago, TCLT said:

NC restaurants and bars to be ordered to close today, effective 5pm. Take out and delivery orders will still be permitted. Governor Cooper doing his part to affect the election.

Can we cut out the political crap? 

[gman430]

I stand by my statement.
 

Killing the economy off one bar and restaurant at a time. Keep up the great work Cooper. Hope McMaster doesn’t issue this nonsense order. 

Edited March 17, 2020 by gman430

[davidclt]

12 minutes ago, gman430 said:

I stand by my statement.
 

Killing the economy off one bar and restaurant at a time. Keep up the great work Cooper. Hope McMaster doesn’t issue this nonsense order. 

Based on the following: https://www.investmentwatchblog.com/updated-comparison-of-italy-usa-california-and-new-york-confirmed-covid-19-numbers/ I think we can't be too cautious.

Edited March 17, 2020 by davidclt
Added picture.

[urbanlover568]

15 minutes ago, gman430 said:

I stand by my statement.
 

Killing the economy off one bar and restaurant at a time. Keep up the great work Cooper. Hope McMaster doesn’t issue this nonsense order. 

Money > Health ... Got it.

[gman430]

Why not just quarantine the most vulnerable people and let everybody else live their lives normally? And at least Congress is getting along: https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/17/mcconnell-says-senate-wont-pass-coronavirus-bill-without-bold-new-steps.html

Edited March 17, 2020 by gman430

[davidclt]

15 minutes ago, urbanlover568 said:

Money > Health ... Got it.

I think everyone is uncertain, afraid of the future and afraid for their future or just feeling defensive because others around them are acting from a position of self-preservation. I think we're going to learn a lot about ourselves and our fellow humans as we get through this. I'd like to believe that most people are scared and acting in ways that reflect the fear of the unknown. Be kind to one another, we're all on this ship together.

[urbanlover568]

3 minutes ago, davidclt said:

I think everyone is uncertain, afraid of the future and afraid for their future or just feeling defensive because others around them are acting from a position of self-preservation. I think we're going to learn a lot about ourselves and our fellow humans as we get through this. I'd like to believe that most people are scared and acting in ways that reflect the fear of the unknown. Be kind to one another, we're all on this ship together.

Exactly, which is why we all need to make sacrifices for the good the community. This isn't the flu. This is deadlier and had higher hospital percentages. We need to fight for one another. The only way we will get through this is together.

[urbanlover568]

For comparison, Italy which has much more strict lockdowns, their daily infection rate is continuing to rise with the increased lockdowns.