CATS Long Term Transit Plan - Silver, Red Lines

[carolinagarnet]

The areas around Independence do have the density to justify mass transit.  Furthermore, there are more people that commute into Charlotte from Union County than any other county in the region, and by a margin of 25-30% as compared to York County which has the 2nd highest amount of in-commuters.  We can not ignore their importance to the success of a proposed mass transit system in the Southeast corridor.

 

I know this is a huge generalization, but it seems like people moving out to Union County are not the type that care to take mass transit. It might be different if it were light rail, though even then I would question it. Several of my friends' parents have moved from Mecklenberg to Union County and while they certainly do not represent everyone, they are generally motivated by lower taxes and more space/more independence. That mentality does not usually lend itself well to collective activities of which mass transit is perhaps the best example.

[cltbwimob]

I know this is a huge generalization, but it seems like people moving out to Union County are not the type that care to take mass transit. It might be different if it were light rail, though even then I would question it. Several of my friends' parents have moved from Mecklenberg to Union County and while they certainly do not represent everyone, they are generally motivated by lower taxes and more space/more independence. That mentality does not usually lend itself well to collective activities of which mass transit is perhaps the best example.

The same suburban mindset is present in those who move to SC...Lower taxes, etc.; yet South Carolina residents use the Blue Line en mass. They are a big part of the reason the Blue Line is successful from a ridership perspective. My parents, who live in Union County and are 100% Republican, love their space and their lower taxes but are extremely supportive of mass transit of the rail variety. They think the transit system should be rapidly expanded. So the attitudes against rail transit exist primarily in the JLF blog space.

[Norm2]

The same suburban mindset is present in those who move to SC...Lower taxes, etc.; yet South Carolina residents use the Blue Line en mass. They are a big part of the reason the Blue Line is successful from a ridership perspective. My parents, who live in Union County and are 100% Republican, love their space and their lower taxes but are extremely supportive of mass transit of the rail variety. They think the transit system should be rapidly expanded. So the attitudes against rail transit exist primarily in the JLF blog space.

Suburbanites may like the light rail because they don't have to drive into Uptown when they use it. You know driving Uptown for most suburbanites is a confusing experience because they are not used to parking garages and one way streets lol.

[queensguy06]

I do the reverse commute out to Monroe (down 74 aka Independence) for work.  I am so greatful I do not have to do the opposite.  The traffic going into the city in the evening is surprsingly heavy, and it takes anywhere from 30-40 minutes to get from 5 miles beyond 485 to the Plaza Midwood area.  The traffic going out of the city in the evening is INSANE.  I suggest driving from downtown Charlotte to 485 around 5:30 during the week.  I would guess the folks that live out here in Monroe/Matthews would overwhelmingly support, and more importantly, utilize mass transit down Independence to 485.  The only other viable alternative is to make Independence freeway all the way out, but that seems short sighted.  At some point even that will become heavily congested and alternatives (ala mass transit) will have to be considered.

[Matthew.Brendan]

Independence needs to be Freeway out to at least 485 ASAP. Maybe in another 20 years.

Light rail can't come soon enough, but sadly 20 years is likely insanely optimistic on that one.

[DEnd]

Independence needs to be Freeway out to at least 485 ASAP. Maybe in another 20 years.

Light rail can't come soon enough, but sadly 20 years is likely insanely optimistic on that one.

 

I'd rather see rail than more Independence freeway.

[kermit]

This is certainly not a surprise (nor should it effect BLE funding) but it appears that state support of urban transit is about to come to an end:

http://www.heraldsun.com/news/x1592161940/Senate-budget-puts-brakes-on-transit

This will certainly make the red line tougher to pay for.

[cltbwimob]

^^^North Carolina Senate Budget Committee IQ test (with answer key and references):

 

Question: What objects float?

Answer: Ducks, Small Rocks, and Witches (Ref: Monty Python's Guide to Hydrodynamics)

 

Question: Where is the sun in relation to the earth?

Answer: Orbiting the earth approximately 93 million miles away (Ref: Ptolemy's Universe)

 

Question: If a ship leaves Wilmington, goes through the Panama Canal,  and then travels due west, where will that ship eventually terminate it's journey? 

Answer: In outer space as it will have fallen off the edge of the earth (Ref: World Geography by Ptolemy)

[15895]

McCrory Is no different. He makes it clear even in a room full of Charlotteans about our future all he says is "that's what the 1/2 tax was for".....

Does the fact that the 1/2 cent tax fell short mean the entire transportation project loses its merit?! Does he think the blue line was a failure? Did he only support transit projects because he thought the 1/2 cent tax was just fun money and thought it would cover it?

It was never McCrorys plan in the first place. He never believed in his own plan. He still doesn't.

For what it's worth I'm positive about our future in regards to transit (& everything, really). I think the Red Line will be easier to fund as I think it will have some 'pub supporters. We can figure out the gold line on our own & hopefully the Silver Line will be gaining steam by the time their is a friendly legislature.

Even if McCrory is against this anti-transit mess, he just seems to be a weak leader. This is evident in the airport authority. All he can parrot is "this is an internal Charlotte problem".... Considering like 27% or so of Charlotteans approve of the bill... It isn't so "Charlotte" to me... Theyre elected by us, not a couple of special interest groups.... He needs to be a leader... He sure did tell us "don't support the streetcar or Raleigh will take away the Lynx" but he sure won't say anything about the airport....

Edited May 24, 2013 by AirNostrumMAD

[Norm2]

What is the Silver Line?

[HopHead]

Can't say I'm surprised... Why, oh why do people keep voting for these idiots. I'm sure Fayetteville is due for a loop though.

[15895]

What is the Silver Line?

I thought it was the name for either BRT or LRT down independence. I could be wrong though.

[DEnd]

I thought it was the name for either BRT or LRT down independence. I could be wrong though.

 

You're not entirely wrong.  At this point considering the state's stance on transit I'd argue an acceptable answer could also be: A Fantasy!

Edited May 24, 2013 by DEnd

[cltbwimob]

Fortunately the transit working group assumes that state money for transit projects will be scarce and have proposed alternate methods of financing...

Is it too late for Charlotte to secede from NC and become a part of SC

[DEnd]

Is it too late for Charlotte to secede from NC and become a part of SC

 

Would that mean it would get the Colbert bump?

[kermit]

It appears that three private companies have submitted unsolicited (?) proposals to design and build the Virginia Beach extension to the Norfolk LRT system. The linked story is brief but the involvement of private firms at this stage of the process (the Norfolk equivalent of the MTC has not yet decided to build the extension) may represent a significant change in how transit is developed and financed.

 

A private-sector proposal to extend light rail into Virginia Beach merits a closer look and competing ideas will be welcomed, the City Council informally decided Tuesday. The decision means the city will further evaluate the proposal submitted earlier this year by a group led by Philip Shucet, a former president of Hampton Roads Transit, the regional transportation authority.

 

 

Spore said the city should explore private proposals to extend light rail because it could transfer some financial risk to the private sector, encourage competition and make the project happen faster.

 

If it works in Norfolk I can't imagine that a similar strategy could not be applied to the CityLynx Gold extension, the airport line or the SE line.

[MilZ]

Hopefully the people who get rammed into the airport have the same philosophy haha

[SouthEndCLT811]

It appears that three private companies have submitted unsolicited (?) proposals to design and build the Virginia Beach extension to the Norfolk LRT system. The linked story is brief but the involvement of private firms at this stage of the process (the Norfolk equivalent of the MTC has not yet decided to build the extension) may represent a significant change in how transit is developed and financed.

 

 

 

If it works in Norfolk I can't imagine that a similar strategy could not be applied to the CityLynx Gold extension, the airport line or the SE line.

 

Same thing is happening in Detroit.  Privately funded light rail is also happening there.  Although the rendering and general length of the line (3.3 miles) leads me to believe it'll be more of a streetcar but that's beside the point.

 

http://www.freep.com/article/20120423/NEWS01/120423048

 

http://www.freep.com/article/20120430/NEWS01/120430037/Chrysler-Woodward-light-rail

 

 

With Chrysler’s commitment to light rail, the number of corporate and nonprofit groups pledging to sponsor stations has grown to 15. Others include Quicken Loans, Compuware, the Detroit Medical Center, Henry Ford Health System. the Ilitch companies, Penske Corp., Wayne State University, Chevrolet, the Downtown Development Association, and the Kresge, Hudson-Webber, Ford and Kellogg foundations.

[kermit]

I stumbled across some project propaganda for the Bleachery in Rock Hill and was surprised to see that they are considering a streetcar connecting Winthrop, to downtown RH.

http://rockhillbleachery.com/street-car/

 

I do understand that 1) its only about 1 mile and 2) it is VERY unlikely to actually happen (although it is part of their current RFP for the project)  but it does raise the possibility that outlying communities are actually thinking about investments in rail transit (I have heard some rumblings in Concord about BLE extension possibilities as well). On the remote chance that this actually pans out I hope the MTC is able and willing to adapt its plans to leverage any opportunities presented. Commuter rail to Rock Hill (running through to Mt Mourne) may begin to look more feasible when it is connected to a streetcar and significant university. (just blue skying here....)

[kermit]

While its not specific to Charlotte you can read about the legislature's new transportation spending formula which will make it essentially impossible for the state to match any local or federal transit spending.

 

While this should not impact the BLE it will certainly effect the remainder of the 2030 plan (and hammer the Triangle area's transit plans)

 

http://www.newsobserver.com/2013/06/10/2953689/road-worrier-new-transportation.html

 

The money quote:

 

Members of a Department of Transportation advisory group have worried that pushing regional commuter highways will encourage urban sprawl. Hearing of their qualms at a Board of Transportation meeting last week, Transportation Secretary Tony Tata said he might have to “modify” the group’s makeup in order “to support the governor’s vision.”

Edited June 11, 2013 by kermit

[kermit]

^ coincidentally that discussion is occurring one day after the American Public Transportation Institute conducted a survey of 1,501 Americans on their attitudes towards public transit. 73.6% of respondents supported or strongly supported the use of tax dollars to expand transit in their communities (up from 69% last year)

 

http://www.apta.com/resources/reportsandpublications/Documents/APTA-Survey-Americas-Support-Public-Transportation.pdf

Edited June 11, 2013 by kermit

[cltbwimob]

^^^Freedom of opinion...it's a wonderful thing. If you don't agree with the governor, then prepare to be replaced.

I guess we get to see the pure idiocy of the TEA party experiment on a large scale.

[nowensone]

So where do I go to sign the recall referendum?  Ridiculous.

[kermit]

NM, I misread the article.

Edited June 19, 2013 by kermit

[kermit]

Gold rush Orange line service ends on July 1. (tryon st service)

http://www.bizjournals.com/charlotte/blog/going_green/2013/06/cats-end-of-gold-rush-orange-line.html?ana=e_du_pub&s=article_du&ed=2013-06-25&u=jDmEk+CKbYnAvaVfOFOlFGXcGSC&t=1372206378

Edit: sorry about mixing routes. Route corrected above

Edited June 26, 2013 by kermit