DESTROYED: Providence Fruit & Produce Warehouse

[provid]

I think the building across from " marshalls " is owned by a club.

[BBascule]

Imagine a few tables out on the deck in the summer providing all weather dining opportunities. I can think of quite a few buildings just like this in the warehouse district in Pittsburgh and in LoDo Denver that have just that!

I have to agree that this solution is uninspired. They're basically just retrofitting a big box complex into the footprint of the warehouse. Sure they might be keeping the shell, but is it asking too much to find a better use for the space?

A market in the spirit of Quincy or downtown Portland. Maybe a colonnade of some of the areas best ethnic foods and markets. These aren

[eltron]

I think this is the architect that just moved into the Peerless building.

Nah, thats Donald Powers.

[eltron]

I was just in Chicago and went to a best buy (needed headphones for my walkaround) in a very similar location to this...right between the highway and METRA tracks...parking for the best buy and a Kohls was in a 3 floor parking deck in between, with nice landscaping all around. definitely a nice solution. I wouldn't be opposed to some big box here, but it really needs to strive to a slightly higher standard...

[Jerry2]

I was just in Chicago and went to a best buy (needed headphones for my walkaround) in a very similar location to this...right between the highway and METRA tracks...parking for the best buy and a Kohls was in a 3 floor parking deck in between, with nice landscaping all around. definitely a nice solution. I wouldn't be opposed to some big box here, but it really needs to strive to a slightly higher standard...

Does anybody else think that this a terrible location for big box retail without some other type of transportation reconfiguration? All PP Mall traffic from the north and west is directed to this "dead-end loop" area. When people leave the mall in one of the mystery exits, they are left to aimlessly wander to find an exit strategy. It already is a traffic nightmare and this would make it even worse. I would rather see the Quincy Market place reserved for the other Farmers Market that actually still exists down the road abutting the Locomotive project. That place could use a rehab. I think this building has had its air share of damage and could see it go down. There isn't anything architecturally worth saving about it as it has become the largest eyesore in the whole city. I would rather see housing( brownstones, townhomes,etc.) constructed here with a mix of neighborhood service retail outlets interwoven in the fabric. At least it could potentially give the are some character with the Promenade facelift, the 903, and the Foundry.

[Garris]

Can I get an AMEN!?

I have no issue with big boxes coming here in an urban context...

AMEN!!

This feels like air deflating from a balloon. What a huge disappointment. I'm actually not against the big box aspect at all (in fact, I think it's one of the only things that has a chance of being commercially viable here), but the execution, in full Seekonk-strip-plaza fashion, well... it's...

It's just beyond disappointing. It's the kind of least-common-denominator planning and lack of imagination that has created the skepticism we hear from so many in the community about projects. I was just last evening talking to a community leader who was saying that citizens have been burned on design and planning issues like this so many times in the past that they have trouble trusting developers, architects, and, most importantly, the city government on almost anything now.

After seeing plans like this, I can understand why. If they can't/don't want to/don't have the imagination to save the front overhang and can't figure out another place to put those cars except between the retail and everything else in the city, then don't bother. I'd rather sit there and have it decay waiting for someone with the proper vision (like Cotuit!) to have a shot. I agree with Jen, it should go back out to bidding if this is their solution.

This one shouldn't pass go.

- Garris

[Cotuit]

I think this is another case of our city's lack of signage doing a huge disservice. It's really very easy to get to 95 and 6/10 from here, there just needs to be some signs to tell people. I do think if there is large scale retail here (i.e. big boxes), there needs to be better public transit (any public transit). A north/south route from PC down Dean to Federal Hill is needed. And something needs to run east/west along the river. Also, the expressway style of the roads around the Dean Street interchange needs to be fixed so residents of Federal Hill and Smith Hill can actually walk here without risking their lives.

Also, there needs to be a better pedestrian experience under the mall. People should be able to park here, or at the mall and walk to the other, or park here and walk Downcity.

[Cotuit]

It's just beyond disappointing. It's the kind of least-common-denominator planning and lack of imagination that has created the skepticism we hear from so many in the community about projects.

What's extra troubling, is that this is not like Eagle Square, where there are a smattering of buildings needing saving and the parking needs to be jammed in wherever it can fit. There's plenty of room for creative solutions to the parking issue here that don't put parking between the street and the building. This is one long straight building with lots of space infront of it and behind it. There's no excuse for not hiding the parking.

[AriPVD]

That is clearly an old and probably outdated site plan.

[Cotuit]

That is clearly an old and probably outdated site plan.

The one I posted was dated July '06, I would certainly be happy to learn that they had a shiny new non-surface parking, urban-minded plan hiding somewhere.

[mental757]

while probably too big, I was sorta hoping this could become the Quincy market of Provicence. The covered loading dock would be seating for all the food choices and restaurants. The main building would be the shops and eateries. If there is a upper floor those could be used for artist studios, maybe dance or martial arts studios, etc. they could build a multi level garage behind the building with a public green with trees, benches, fountains, etc. betwee the loadig docks and the street. The amount of residential in the Foundry, 903, ALCO, etc. would make great use of all of that...

[DaveRPI]

This is more of a general comment, but what is the huge issue with surface parking? I realize large areas of parking lots aren't pretty to look at, but in a city lacking in the mass transit department, I don't see Providence as a city with a limited number of cars. Let's face it, surface parking is needed for a development such as this.

If I remember correctly, Cathedral Square was an attempt to discourage car use, and we all know how well that turned out.

exactly

NITVOP

not in their vision of providence

it is what it is, and right now its a city and state without widely supported and effective mass transit. the older generations here have not embraced the idea for developing much more effective mass transit

its just not economically viable to have a development such as this in RI without parking of some sorts, plus, this us UNDERNEATH THE HIGHWAY

btw the plans look like there are some sort of developments rising above the stores and garage level, is that correct?

[DaveRPI]

while probably too big, I was sorta hoping this could become the Quincy market of Provicence. The covered loading dock would be seating for all the food choices and restaurants. The main building would be the shops and eateries. If there is a upper floor those could be used for artist studios, maybe dance or martial arts studios, etc. they could build a multi level garage behind the building with a public green with trees, benches, fountains, etc. betwee the loadig docks and the street. The amount of residential in the Foundry, 903, ALCO, etc. would make great use of all of that...

martial arts studios are not located in quincy market [could they afford the rent? haha]

quincy market is mainly a TOURIST destination

quincy market is located directly adjacent to the downtown core of boston

this site is separated from our downtown core physically and psychologically by the train tracks, the highways, no straight line path/road to the site, the gigantic mall, etc etc

AND the proposition is creating a restaurant row so close to our already existing restaurant row on federal hill? and the mall's food court and restaurants on francis? I'm all for competition, but that would be cannibalism at its finest. one or two places to eat- OK, but a whole street lined with them? only way i like this idea is if there are large pedestrian bridges over route 10 connecting people from federal hill and the western portion of downtown providence and there is the addition of some sort of "regional" attraction to its immediate area...

too many assumptions, not enough facts...

[Liamlunchtray]

My 2 cents:

Urban Target at one end of the building and a Trader Joes at the other with a market like Portland's Public Market in between. The Target and the Trader Joes would pull people to the building as they are destinations and then once they are there they can check out the food options in the Market. There could easily be some restaurants worked into the mix as well. With the large amount of housing going into the area (903, Foundry, Alco, etc) I think there are enough people to keep the market concept afloat even though it is cut off from downtown. The Big Box of Target should provide stability and If you plunked in a best buy or some nonsense seperate from the main building it would even further cement it as a retail center. The overhang could be kept for open air dining areas as well as perhaps kiosks. I dont see why Big Box and smaller independent businesses need to always be seperated. They seem to like the "Branding" concept in their developments, but with something like this the Public Market could be branded unto itself.

[mental757]

martial arts studios are not located in quincy market [could they afford the rent? haha]

quincy market is mainly a TOURIST destination

quincy market is located directly adjacent to the downtown core of boston

this site is separated from our downtown core physically and psychologically by the train tracks, the highways, no straight line path/road to the site, the gigantic mall, etc etc

AND the proposition is creating a restaurant row so close to our already existing restaurant row on federal hill? and the mall's food court and restaurants on francis? I'm all for competition, but that would be cannibalism at its finest. one or two places to eat- OK, but a whole street lined with them? only way i like this idea is if there are large pedestrian bridges over route 10 connecting people from federal hill and the western portion of downtown providence and there is the addition of some sort of "regional" attraction to its immediate area...

too many assumptions, not enough facts...

I was just thinking out loud really...

[DaveRPI]

i like idea for produce markets and a target, but that wouldnt fit with the hotel idea... in my mind, the area has to go one way or another... target/markets - then its a new neigborhood... hotel/food court/regional attraction - then its an extension of downtown

i think it has a better chance for survival business-wise if they went the "neighborhood" route, but i guess will see

my fav spot for a target is in the triangle b/w J&WU, the jewelry district and the upper south side... [first 2 floors of the proposed courthouse parking garage]

i dont even get to shop at these much and i dont know many other local brands like this but, why doesnt the mgmt at dave's marketplace produce stores try to put one in the city somewhere? historically they dont have large footprints, they are a local chain, and they seem to focus on fresh produce, etc [how about somewhere b/w the lofts, finanical district, and risd/brown/j&wu]

[Cotuit]

I just put a hotel in there because it's come up a few times, both on the board and from the developer. I'd much rather see a new lower priced (replacement for the Holiday Inn) hotel in the Jewelry District so that it can also serve the hospitals.

[Liamlunchtray]

i like idea for produce markets and a target, but that wouldnt fit with the hotel idea... in my mind, the area has to go one way or another... target/markets - then its a new neigborhood... hotel/food court/regional attraction - then its an extension of downtown

i think it has a better chance for survival business-wise if they went the "neighborhood" route, but i guess will see

my fav spot for a target is in the triangle b/w J&WU, the jewelry district and the upper south side... [first 2 floors of the proposed courthouse parking garage]

i dont even get to shop at these much and i dont know many other local brands like this but, why doesnt the mgmt at dave's marketplace produce stores try to put one in the city somewhere? historically they dont have large footprints, they are a local chain, and they seem to focus on fresh produce, etc [how about somewhere b/w the lofts, finanical district, and risd/brown/j&wu]

Going back to the age old "which supermarket downtown" debate - I think daves would be a perfect fit with the upwardly mobile loft dweller / empty nester sorts.

[jencoleslaw]

i have been assured that this will come to the CPC. it is currently being reviewed by the state historic preservation commission.

[mental757]

yea, reviewed and dismissed, hopefully...

[jencoleslaw]

it will be a public hearing when it does come before the CPC so i sure hope you all show up and say what needs to be said....

[Frankie811]

No photos for this project yet, but some demographic and brochure info.

http://www.carpionatoproperties.com/propsp...0103&Type=2

[bhooley]

No photos for this project yet, but some demographic and brochure info.

http://www.carpionatoproperties.com/propsp...0103&Type=2

I don't know if this means anything but it might be worth noting that this project is listed under both the Hotel properties and Retail properties sections of their website.

Anyway, hope this ends up being cooler than a Target and Best Buy kind of shopping center, but I have my doubts. Throw in a Starbucks while you're at it Carpionato!

[glassandsteel]

OH, HELL F*****G NO!!!!! Did anybody look at the brochure? This thing is surrounded by parking on THREE sides?!?!?! No! No! No!!! I won't allow it. They are NOT putting surface parking in a potentially dynamic area of town. No! Do these jackasses only know how to build strip malls? What a horrendous waste of potential and a total lack of creativity. Holy crap, I'm soooo pissed right now. So pissed. This is not going to happen. How totally mindless. I swear this is not going to happen.

I'm writing until I get a satisfactory response from these pricks. If you give a damn, I'd suggest you do the same. What this area needs is to fill in the lots it currently has, not add new ones.

[provid]

All of this was discussed ( and more ) a few weeks and a few pages back.