Overnight Onstreet Parking

[runawayjim]

while i agree that it all needs enforcement, i'm glad that city is starting to do something. at least they're realizing that they don't have enough bodies to do all the enforcement themselves.

i think the article said that the majority of the tickets are people going over the time limit on meters and parking in no parking zones. it didn't mention overnight parking, maybe (i hope) because the pilot is going well and they're going to extend it to the rest of the city...

[Cotuit]

parking infractions like parking on sidewalks so you can't cross without going in the street, or in crosswalks

[jencoleslaw]

i would rather the city put its efforts towards things that impact quality of life and contribute to the city's bottom line, rather than continue to ignore such things and instead rely on these enforcement =money making schemes. would you guys really rather that cars get booted over ticketing someone for not de-icing or shoveling their sidewalk? Why do we keep bringing in these outside companies to do the work that we're already paying the city to do?

[runawayjim]

i would rather the city put its efforts towards things that impact quality of life and contribute to the city's bottom line, rather than continue to ignore such things and instead rely on these enforcement =money making schemes. would you guys really rather that cars get booted over ticketing someone for not de-icing or shoveling their sidewalk? Why do we keep bringing in these outside companies to do the work that we're already paying the city to do?

[Cotuit]

Can't we have it all, why does it have to be either or?

And I think people flouting the parking laws is a quality of life issue. Getting people to obey parking and traffic laws will go a long way towards creating a civil society within the city. People are going to have to learn that they can no longer do whatever the hell they want.

[jencoleslaw]

Can't we have it all, why does it have to be either or?

And I think people flouting the parking laws is a quality of life issue. Getting people to obey parking and traffic laws will go a long way towards creating a civil society within the city. People are going to have to learn that they can no longer do whatever the hell they want.

[runawayjim]

you're right, we shouldn't have to choose, but that's exactly what the city is doing, by prioritizing late parking tickets over quality of life issues that affect all of us--me getting a party ticket and being late in paying it really doesn't affect you at all, except in an abstract kind of way. But if i let my dog bark outside your apartment all night long, or i left my sidewalk unshoveled for weeks or i put my trash out in plastic bags that the rats tear open--that would affect you (and many others.) I would prefer that the city address these sorts of things FIRST rather than booting cars for cash. Parking ticket scoffers do get punished. Their accounts get transferred to a collection company and it impacts their credit rating, and they run the risk of getting the boot, even without a special company to meter out the justice.

[brick]

you're right, we shouldn't have to choose, but that's exactly what the city is doing, by prioritizing late parking tickets over quality of life issues that affect all of us--me getting a party ticket and being late in paying it really doesn't affect you at all, except in an abstract kind of way. But if i let my dog bark outside your apartment all night long, or i left my sidewalk unshoveled for weeks or i put my trash out in plastic bags that the rats tear open--that would affect you (and many others.) I would prefer that the city address these sorts of things FIRST rather than booting cars for cash. Parking ticket scoffers do get punished. Their accounts get transferred to a collection company and it impacts their credit rating, and they run the risk of getting the boot, even without a special company to meter out the justice.

[inProv]

Why do we keep bringing in these outside companies to do the work that we're already paying the city to do?

[runawayjim]

They will address whatever gets them the most revenue.

Here is what is irritating to me about the program.

1) Why are we sending money to New Jersey to boot cars?

2) They still haven't completed fixing the signage and meters, but are going for this instead. I'm sure they will issue people refunds when they can prove there was no way to know they were parking illegally, but to me those issues should be fixed first.

3) I would rather not live in a police state, quite frankly.

4) This has been a key issue of the mayor's since election and quite frankly it is the stupidest key issue I've ever heard of in my life. As Jen notes, the city has a lot of problems that go way beyond parking ticket payment.

5) The problem with the implication that this is motivated by revenue generation is that it is not a sustainable income. Therefore, what happens when people do get trained and the city isn't taking in that money that they had been counting on? Look at all of the states that are crying poor because they don't collect as much cigarette tax anymore. I would rather the city figure out how to balance a budget than try to find more ways to generate a short term revenue hit.

[brick]

I refuse to argue politics in an online forum but it wrong to say that giving the government the right to effectively seize your property is in no way the farthest thing from a police state. The farthest thing from a police state would be if they said that the solution to the parking ticket backlog is to stop ticketing.

If people are lazy and are just going to soak up fines anyway, then that 100% shoots down Cotuit's theory that this is for any altruistic reason. Can we at least all agree that it is for making money, and that they would rather have people parking illegally than not, as long as those people then pay the fines?

FTR, since I know the first thought out of people's heads - I have only received one parking ticket in 15 years of parking in Providence. (My choice was to leave my car on the street or drive drunk after a party.) I have no special grudge against the system.

[Cotuit]

I refuse to argue politics in an online forum but it wrong to say that giving the government the right to effectively seize your property is in no way the farthest thing from a police state.

[brick]

People do not have a Constitutional right to leave their cars wherever they damn well please.

[Cotuit]

So what, I'm not arguing for constitutional law.

People also have no constitutional right to be married (any appeals to pursuit of happiness are trumped by most of the married couples I know), but the government restrictions on that are something that piss you off, aren't they?

(this is not to say that my opinion is that people shouldn't have the right to get married, just to point out the constitution doesn't guarantee that right)

[jencoleslaw]

i don't care how far afield you guys get in arguing this, but unpaid parking tickets and getting the boot (and the boot does get out there, even without this new system--i was booted in college and you can be damned sure that i pay all my parking tickets relatively on time now, or pay them late with fees) is an incentive to pay them. It is not like no one ever gets booted, just that the city only tasks one guy to put on the boots. I see plenty of boots at the end of every semester, both downtown, and in the neighborhoods where college kids live.

my point CONTINUES to be that while this is a problem, and a revenue generator, there are far more egregious sins that could be both enforced and bring in some cheddah, that affect the populace far more than unpaid parking tickets. And if the city is going to prioritize, then i want them to prioritize towards real quality of life issues like rats, trash, vacant lots etc. As i said before, there's something very wrong when it costs more to get your car out of hock for a few tickets than it does to tear down a building without a demo permit, or to build without a building permit or to pave over your back yard or any number of things.

and as an aside, when did this thing show up?

[runawayjim]

there has always been the off topic smiley, but i'm not sure if it was that one exactly. you just had to click "show all" to see it. they also added some new ones.

i've never seen a car with a boot here, but i did hear a story from the mr lemon guy about a PC kid who went to him and asked if he had a hammer or crowbar. the kid removed the boot himself and went on his way.

anyways, i think the city is looking at the biggest, quickest revenue generator, but again... i think this is just the beginning of enforcement.

[basachs]

In a quirk of events, I got a ticket on Greene St on Friday. I was 8 minutes over the alloted meter time. I remember reading the back of the ticket and seeing that 5 tickets got you the boot and thinking that was a lot of leeway. Also that the fines are ridiculously cheap. I mailed the check out on Saturday and on Sunday this article showed up.

Now I realize I am in the minority as far as paying my tickets on time. I have no problem with implementing this program and raising fees, except for the fact that I want to know where this estimated 3 million in additional revenue is going to go. If the city governement said that it was going to go to improving signage and other quality of life issues, then I am an even stronger supporter.

I just hate how there are a lot of numbers thrown around all the time with regards to projected revenue from a yet to be implemented program with no projected allocation as well. If you can estimate how much you are going to get, then you can also esitmate what you are going to do with it. Letting the public know that can go a long way to alleviating concerns about these programs.

[brick]

Why is the conversation turning towards my sexuality?

What is police state about booting? Every civilized city in the country does it. You don't want to have your property seized, don't do something illegal with it. Is arresting people for breaking the law a police state? Should people be allowed to do whatever they want in public?

[jencoleslaw]

as few as 50 tickets per night on 6 trash nights a week, for 52 weeks a year, at $50 per ticket would gross $780K.

[Cotuit]

It is police state when you say that you lose your right to your car because you have scoffed at the law. Whether this is really a violation is of someone's civil liberties is unequivocal. Whether the system in place provides for fair treatment of people up until this point is somewhat under debate. I may be wrong but that is how I read the councilman's comments. It is important to understand the connotations of this step and that the legislature considers these connotations. However this is just my opinion.

[runawayjim]

is it a police state when the government siezes your property because of unpaid taxes or a big drug bust? is it a police state when the bank siezes your car because you haven't make payments?

i consider this to be similar. if you break the law, you face consequences. this is a very well known and tried consequence. now if i was under constant surveillance no matter where i was (public or private places), then yes, i'd cry police state. but not for getting the boot. it's pretty easy to "un-sieze" your car... pay the damn fine!

[Cotuit]

Why does this city have to get into a complete panic every time something other cities do without issue is proposed here? I mean look at the madness over overnight parking. Why the panic?

[gregw]

The 5th Amendment gives Government the right to deprive a person of his property as long as there is due process. As long as the owner of the car can have a fair hearing, i.e. to show that the city booted his car in error, then I don't see how this is a violation of civil liberties.

The government has to be able to enforce its laws -- otherwise they are meaningless. And here the seizure of property is temporary as long as the fines get paid.

[campster]

Grrrrrrrr... So we get through almost an entire winter without significant snowfall, and after yesterday's storm my tenant woke up this morning to find her windshield demolished by an avalanche from the slate-roofed house next door. Our driveway's all but useless when it snows.

Meanwhile, in just about every other town in New England, people are waking up and shovelling out of on-street parking spaces, their windshields intact, just as they have for decades. And life goes on...

[gregw]

Grrrrrrrr... So we get through almost an entire winter without significant snowfall, and after yesterday's storm my tenant woke up this morning to find her windshield demolished by an avalanche from the slate-roofed house next door. Our driveway's all but useless when it snows.

Meanwhile, in just about every other town in New England, people are waking up and shovelling out of on-street parking spaces, their windshields intact, just as they have for decades. And life goes on...