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COMPLETE: The Old Public Safety Surface Lot

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Baines Hamlet

Baines

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I hate to jump on the cynical bus, but can't they at least wait until they get all their city planning and design approvals to start demo work. I'd prefer an empty building to a dirt lot.

Here is my take on this...

TPG is in the stage now that it wants to display dramatic activity in the PowerBlock fom one end to the other. They want to build momentum, a feeling of a big and vibrant future, and use thesesvisual signs of change for marketing.

I suspect that once the demo is near complete there will be barrier fences (like at the WestinII and OneTen) that depict the rendering of EOB.

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Baines Hamlet

Baines

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Once they get the demolision permit I'm sure they get started right away before someone can change their mind. It is much easier, for instance, for a trespasser to get hurt inside an abondoned building. And you can't really squat in an empty lot.

Also, it could be subtle psychological manipulation - i.e. everyone prefers a building to an empty lot, so maybe they get a very subtle push in the direction of building approvals if there is a lot there instead of the building.

Here is my tae on this...

TPG is at the stage now that it wants to display a dramatic sense of action from one end of the Power Block to the next. Creating a strong image of action, growth, revitalization, and economic activity will greatly aid in marketing for the EOB, Westin II, and OneEleven.

I expect that soon after demolition is underway or near complete there will be a barrier fence (like the Westin II and One Ten) which depicts the EOB rendering.

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RLucas83 Whistle-Stop

RLucas83

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We might see this go a little taller.

Don't pee your pants Mikey, I said might.

Well ill take that as a good indication of how the office space market looks, unless they are looking to split usage as well or put something else in there too.

On a side note... if all goes well in the next two weeks, i'll become a rhode islander again, and 1-2000 sf of office space will be taken off the market :unsure::whistling: *fingers crossed*

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Cotuit Megalopolis

Cotuit

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This was on the DRC agenda tonight as well, from my notes:

New building would be 22 stories tall, In '98-'99 demolision was approved for an Embassy Suites that was never built, demolision permit lapsed when plans fell through, project would have been 150 feet tall. Current plans from TPG are conceptual. Request is for demolision and transitional use as surface parking. TPG understands it will need to meet reqirements for landscaping and other requirements for transitional use.

Tom Niles from TPG: Made it clear they were not there to seek approval for deisgn, design is conceptual. Existing building was design for a special purpose which it no longer is able to serve (hence the new Public Safety Building). The building is obsolete, TPG cannot think of a use that would preserve the structure. TPG understands the building and location is prominent. The current buidling in it's current vacant state is dangerous and TPG is having trouble securing it, and has experienced many break-ins. They are concenred the building is becoming a blight. The current building in it's current state detracts from the Hilton and other buildings and residents in the area. TPG wants to capture the current momentum in Providence. They are seeking no public subsidies. This project will be hard to pull off in the current market and it will be work to follow thw market in designing this building. TPG is not in the business of creating vacant land, and operating surface parking is not part fo their business model.

Mark Spaulding from Symmes Maini & McKee Associates architect: Building site is 44,000 square feet. Broadway is being narrowed at LaSalle Square and a little piece is being added to the parcel as a result. The lobby will be at the corner of Empire and Broadway on LaSalle Square (across from the Hilton's glass box). Building will average 310 feet, about 315 feet from the lowest point of the LaSalle Square side. Will be built to the street on all sides. Ground level retail will be on the Empire (LaSalle Square) and Broadway facades. Parking garage entrance will be at the corner of Green and Fountain Streets. The street elevation is 13 feet higher at Green and Fountain than it is at LaSalle Square, making entry to the parking garage better here. The building rises to 64 feet when it steps back and the tower continues up to 310 feet. There is a setback on the Fountain Street side which is about the same hieght as the library, the parking sits above the retail inside this 64 foot high section. Parking also sticks out at Broadway and Green in a 64 foot high section. Building rises to its full height from the corner of Broadway and Empire. The building should serve as an anchor for LaSalle Square. The lobby will be a public space. The building will incorporate an interpretive design to reflect the old Public Safety Building and the history of the site (unclear what the hell this means). The tower is angeld to allign with the buidlings on Sabin Street. The tower is made of glass curtain walls and metal.

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jencoleslaw Town

jencoleslaw

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This was on the DRC agenda tongiht as well, from my notes:

This project will be hard to pull off in the current market and it will be work to follow thw market in designing this building. TPG is not in the business of creating vacant land, and operating surface parking is not part fo their business model.

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Cotuit Megalopolis

Cotuit

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I will put up my Christmas lights tonight if they approved the demolisions.

Really, the way he was talking about how hard it is to guage the market and how much work it will take to keep up with it was not inspiring confidence in the idea that this building will ever be built. Which in turn makes one feel more like they should maybe wait until they tear anything down.

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brick Burg

brick

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I would agree about the tearing down. It's too bad that the building can't be used for something as-is, though. Frankly I agree with their point that it is quickly becoming a blight. I also think the Fogarty building is kind of a blight. These unoocupied buildings sitting along with the Projo and the completely lifeless BCBS building really create a disconnect between this area with the rest of the city. (Not to mention that you then get onto Fountain and hit surface parking at Mathewson to go along with the Metropark, the Sportsman Inn, and the very shady coffee shop). If I were a visitor in the convention center I would have a hard time believing there was anything within walking distance going south and would just end up at the mall.

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Cotuit Megalopolis

Cotuit

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Some of the public comment on this:

  • Current building has important relationship to library.

  • Saving the Fountain Street facade should be investigated.

  • Lower levels (garage levels) need to be more lively.

  • Design does not give enough back for the loss of the Public Safety Building.

  • The Weybosset facade at OneTen is a good inspiration for this project.

  • Issuing a demo permit for this building now is premature.

  • The Duany proposal which saved the Public Safety Building facades was brought up.

  • The LaSalle Square facade should be saved.

  • New building should respect historic buildings in the area while looking toward other more modern buildings nearby, bridge the gap.

  • Design needs to be more complete.

  • Developer should consider the historic tax credits it could get if it saves the existing structure.

  • The vacancy issues should not translate to demolition, all building owners are responsible for the security of their structures. AS220 has kept the Dreyfuss secure as an example.

  • Building should include municipal parking component (it will have 522 spaces, 484 required by zoning).

  • What are the shadow impacts of the tower?

Planning staff recommended not allow permit and to continue the request until more concrete plans come in, though staff is pleased with the current direction of the building.

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Cotuit Megalopolis

Cotuit

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Yes, the LaSalle side is the garage doors, and I agree, there is a much better arguement to be made for saving the Fountain side than the LaSalle side. I can see interesting uses for the garage doors if the building were to be reused as is (I don't believe it's obsolete, but would not be surprised to find that it would be crazy expensive, even with Historic Tax Credits to renovate).

The shadow impacts were serious and a valid concern I suppose. They hadn't done formal studies but concluded that most of the shadows would fall on Broadway and Atwells, but there would be some shadows on LaSalle Square late in the day.

I could certainly see retail on the Fountain side, but really only if Fountain is made two-way and is re-opened all the way to the Service Road through Regency Plaza, which I would actually like to see happen. I think the retail on the LaSalle Square side will at least wrap around onto Fountain, but won't extend all the way down Fountain.

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Cotuit Megalopolis

Cotuit

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the blight is a self-fulfilling prophecy, however. If the building had been secure, it wouldn't be broken into, and it would be far less of a liability. But this is how redevelopment happens. Let thing sit and rot and moulder until it can't be saved and then shrug your shoulders and say "i guess i'll have to take it down because its becoming a public hazard."
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runawayjim Metropolis

runawayjim

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I'm going to disagree with the general opinion about the demolition - I agree it's becoming a blight and the last thing TPG needs is someone breaking in and getting hurt.

If the demolition does happen, though, I would like to see something creative (a la the Grant's Block site).

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mental757 Burg

mental757

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I look at this as a choice between a decaying structure (nice or not) and a parking lot. While not advocating more parking lots, I think it might be better to market this parcel as E@B if it were cleared. Seeing how there is no rush either way, I say the designs and plans should have full approval before it comes down. The chicken or the egg comes into play though since it's tough to finalize a design without having specific tenants on board. Since I dont; know much about the city approval processes, I say TPG should go as far as they can with the design approval and then be allowed to knock down the old FD/PD HQ...

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