Renaissance Tower Development in Fayetteville

[Mith242]

Yeah it's unfortunate things are taking so long. What's also bad is that until things really get going then it makes it harder for what retail/restaurants to survive around that area. I'm just hoping the whole process isn't strung out like this or else it's not going to be open for a very long time.

[mzweig]

"It's happening." BTW, nice, positive and optimistic article.

Great article! Thanks. It's nice to hear about all the new restaurants we could be getting here in Fayetteville.

[mzweig]

Any news on the Ren?

Seems to me that it has been quiet for while...

Update: As of yesterday, the bottom line on the Ren is they don't have their financing secured yet. I know this for a fact from certain knowledgeable sources.

M

[Mith242]

Update: As of yesterday, the bottom line on the Ren is they don't have their financing secured yet. I know this for a fact from certain knowledgeable sources.

M

Ugh, that certainly is what any of us wanted to hear. But at this point I'm trying not to be very optimistic about this whole thing. I'm sure something will eventually be built there. But who knows how long it's going to take. I guess we'll hear more when that deadline starts getting a little closer. I believe it was sometime in September.

[mzweig]

Ugh, that certainly is what any of us wanted to hear. But at this point I'm trying not to be very optimistic about this whole thing. I'm sure something will eventually be built there. But who knows how long it's going to take. I guess we'll hear more when that deadline starts getting a little closer. I believe it was sometime in September.

Those in the know say it will happen it's just that certain borrowers are highly leveraged and have to find and work with some new financing partners.

[masons_dad1]

So the largest development in Fayetteville has no funding? At least developers can learn from this that there is a limit to how big "ideas" can be to become a reality.

[Mith242]

So the largest development in Fayetteville has no funding? At least developers can learn from this that there is a limit to how big "ideas" can be to become a reality.

I think Mark is right though. I think it's going to eventually be built. It's just going to take a lot longer than what everyone had hoped. Does make me wonder though if the city would have gone with someone else if they knew how things were going to go. Even if the old Mountain Inn was an eyesore, having a big empty pit with the backs of buildings that probably haven't seen light for decades isn't helping the area either.

[mzweig]

I think Mark is right though. I think it's going to eventually be built. It's just going to take a lot longer than what everyone had hoped. Does make me wonder though if the city would have gone with someone else if they knew how things were going to go. Even if the old Mountain Inn was an eyesore, having a big empty pit with the backs of buildings that probably haven't seen light for decades isn't helping the area either.

That's a good point, Rod. One thing I do understand is happening right now is that Nock is painting and fixing up those other buildings that surround the Mountain Inn so it does look better.

Guys, I do think it will be built, and I think these developers will be the ones to do it. It is, however, getting harder to borrow money for these kinds of projects. The real estate market is softer, interest rates are higher, and banks are getting hammered by regulators for having too much real estate in the loan portfolios. I think Nock and his partners will get the funds but will have to go to multiple sources and it will take longer and cost them more. That's my best guess of what will happen. Only time will tell. Meanwhile, the Cosmopolitan is being redone and we will have a much better hotel in Fayetteville when that happens.

[cowbreath]

Don't worry the city will raise our taxes another 1% to cover the costs. That'll bring it up to about "all the rest of my money".

[masons_dad1]

Don't worry the city will raise our taxes another 1% to cover the costs. That'll bring it up to about "all the rest of my money".

There will be a lot of smiling faces walking around NWA when Gov. Mike Beebe eradicates that nasty grocery tax. Then Fayetteville can raise taxes all they want without causing any kind of rioting or anything.

[Mith242]

Unfortunately raising the sales tax could happen. Some thing similar happened in Pine Bluff with the convention center. But the bad thing about this is that the city already gave Nock a good deal on this. While I really want the Renaissance to be built. If he can't get it all together I don't think we should raise the sales tax to help him again. I'd rather see it go to another developer. Even if that means something less significant than the Renaissance is built there instead. I just don't think the city should have to keep bending over backwards to get this built.

[mzweig]

Unfortunately raising the sales tax could happen. Some thing similar happened in Pine Bluff with the convention center. But the bad thing about this is that the city already gave Nock a good deal on this. While I really want the Renaissance to be built. If he can't get it all together I don't think we should raise the sales tax to help him again. I'd rather see it go to another developer. Even if that means something less significant than the Renaissance is built there instead. I just don't think the city should have to keep bending over backwards to get this built.

I think sales taxes here are already outrageous. The highest I have witnessed anywhere in the U.S. In Massachusetts, the sales tax is 5%, with nothing on food, drugs, or clothing. This sales tax is regressive and hurts the lower and middle income people much more than those who are affluent. They don't spend 100% of their incomes.

[Mith242]

I think sales taxes here are already outrageous. The highest I have witnessed anywhere in the U.S. In Massachusetts, the sales tax is 5%, with nothing on food, drugs, or clothing. This sales tax is regressive and hurts the lower and middle income people much more than those who are affluent. They don't spend 100% of their incomes.

I think some of the highest sales taxes are in the south. I believe parts of southeast Arkansas also have the highest sales tax in Arkansas as well. Ironically it seems that the poorest areas seem to have the highest sales taxes.

[zman9810]

I think sales taxes here are already outrageous. The highest I have witnessed anywhere in the U.S. In Massachusetts, the sales tax is 5%, with nothing on food, drugs, or clothing. This sales tax is regressive and hurts the lower and middle income people much more than those who are affluent. They don't spend 100% of their incomes.

I have heard that before but have never heard what the local governments in other areas of the country do to raise funds to provide services. If sales taxes aren't used as much, what other funding methods are used? Locally the sales tax money seems to make up a large part of the budgets.

[mzweig]

I have heard that before but have never heard what the local governments in other areas of the country do to raise funds to provide services. If sales taxes aren't used as much, what other funding methods are used? Locally the sales tax money seems to make up a large part of the budgets.

In other places, property taxes are often higher. Also, income tax may be higher, but not always. That's what I have seen, at least.

M.

[Mith242]

In other places, property taxes are often higher. Also, income tax may be higher, but not always. That's what I have seen, at least.

M.

Yeah, I think a lot of other states seem to have higher property taxes than Arkansas. At least from what I've seen.

[masons_dad1]

I think some of the highest sales taxes are in the south. I believe parts of southeast Arkansas also have the highest sales tax in Arkansas as well. Ironically it seems that the poorest areas seem to have the highest sales taxes.

That sounds medieval but it's true.

[zman9810]

In other places, property taxes are often higher. Also, income tax may be higher, but not always. That's what I have seen, at least.

M.

Now that is very interesting, considering that there are low income people( and some higher income people) in this area that think property taxes are illegal and should be abolished entirely. The people who are being affected the most by a regressive tax like a sales tax are against a method that affects the more affluent to a greater degree. I am a native of Arkansas and love the area, but sometimes I'm baffled as to what reasoning is used to arrive at such conclusions.

[mzweig]

Now that is very interesting, considering that there are low income people( and some higher income people) in this area that think property taxes are illegal and should be abolished entirely. The people who are being affected the most by a regressive tax like a sales tax are against a method that affects the more affluent to a greater degree. I am a native of Arkansas and love the area, but sometimes I'm baffled as to what reasoning is used to arrive at such conclusions.

I am with you. I am a native of Missouri and it's culturally much the same as Ark. Somehow the right wing spin doctors have got a lot of folks confused about what is really in their interest. I guess this conversation is for a political forum, though! I sure hope we don't get higher sales taxes here as I just don't think it's good for our area overall. And right now, the City of Fayetteville is worried, as sales tax has declined for six months in a row. Why be more dependent on sales tax for our revenues here? Seems too volatile.

[mzweig]

I spoke briefly with John Nock last night and he said it will be anywhere between two weeks and two months before the Renaissance gets moving. He is also doing some 500-650 square foot cheaper condos in the spaces above Taste of Thai and the new Mexican restaurant over there. You can see new small balconies on the second floor--those are the condos.

Mark

[Mith242]

I spoke briefly with John Nock last night and he said it will be anywhere between two weeks and two months before the Renaissance gets moving. He is also doing some 500-650 square foot cheaper condos in the spaces above Taste of Thai and the new Mexican restaurant over there. You can see new small balconies on the second floor--those are the condos.

Mark

Thanks for the update. I'll have to stop by there and take a closer look.

[Mith242]

I spoke briefly with John Nock last night and he said it will be anywhere between two weeks and two months before the Renaissance gets moving. He is also doing some 500-650 square foot cheaper condos in the spaces above Taste of Thai and the new Mexican restaurant over there. You can see new small balconies on the second floor--those are the condos.

Mark

Yeah I saw the work being done inside there. I also noticed the Cravens Building is all closed up. Does anyone know if this will also have something to do with the Renaissance development?

[Mith242]

Here's a pic of the Industrial Finance Building. basically where the work right now is being done at the Renaissance site.

[mzweig]

Yeah I saw the work being done inside there. I also noticed the Cravens Building is all closed up. Does anyone know if this will also have something to do with the Renaissance development?

My understanding is that all these buildings are owned by Nock and he is going to facelift them a bit so they can be useful while the Ren goes up. I dunno if any will be incorporated into the hotel itself at some point but I do expect the whole area to be redeveloped/rehabbed more extensively after the hotel is in.

[Mith242]

My understanding is that all these buildings are owned by Nock and he is going to facelift them a bit so they can be useful while the Ren goes up. I dunno if any will be incorporated into the hotel itself at some point but I do expect the whole area to be redeveloped/rehabbed more extensively after the hotel is in.

I do appreciate that he's keeping all these building and not just razing them. I imagine that it would have been much easier to tear them down and start totally new. I know I've been impatient with this development. But if this is one of the reasons things are slow then I shouldn't complain.