Orlando Sentinel Property Redevelopment (PLANNED)

[JFW657]

2 hours ago, Uncommon said:

2) Sports and Entertainment District

Guess I was used to seeing it written around here as MEC. 

[jrs2]

On 3/30/2024 at 10:00 AM, dcluley98 said:

LOL, if you have been following this forum for 10 years, IAF (which I thought you had been), you could probably tell I don't bullcrap and things I share happen to be true more often than  not. 

well, you're a Gator, so that's gotta count for something...

[jrs2]

On 3/30/2024 at 11:11 AM, IAmFloridaBorn said:

@dcluley98 It's not you. Its Orlando I don't believe in. 

truer words...

by comparison, in Chi-Town, just about the only projects to not come to fruition were like towers taller that Sears Tower.  Most everything else gets built.  And City Hall has a lot to do with that in Chicago.  That's why I'm always like...Buddy et al need to get their butts to The Loop and talk to "like minded" mayors and staff (or are they really like minded?) to help turn a proposal into "u/c" and then "completed."  Now I know they've got more money to throw around up there, as incentives, but, for all the bad press you hear about Chicago, they still crank out the projects (not "projects" as in "the projects").  

Remember, Chicago snagged the Boeing HQ within the past ten years...  I know City Hall tried to snag JetBlue, and lost Airtran to Southwest... It is what it is.  But, look to my comment on the Attractions thread about the lengths Volusia went to get FDOT to give them $$$ for the US 92/I-4 Interchange redo...maybe City Hall needs to have a point person that specializes in this- in closing the deal with companies coming and developments breaking ground.

[Uncommon]

2 hours ago, jrs2 said:

truer words...

by comparison, in Chi-Town, just about the only projects to not come to fruition were like towers taller that Sears Tower.  Most everything else gets built.  And City Hall has a lot to do with that in Chicago.  That's why I'm always like...Buddy et al need to get their butts to The Loop and talk to "like minded" mayors and staff (or are they really like minded?) to help turn a proposal into "u/c" and then "completed."  Now I know they've got more money to throw around up there, as incentives, but, for all the bad press you hear about Chicago, they still crank out the projects (not "projects" as in "the projects").  

Remember, Chicago snagged the Boeing HQ within the past ten years...  I know City Hall tried to snag JetBlue, and lost Airtran to Southwest... It is what it is.  But, look to my comment on the Attractions thread about the lengths Volusia went to get FDOT to give them $$$ for the US 92/I-4 Interchange redo...maybe City Hall needs to have a point person that specializes in this- in closing the deal with companies coming and developments breaking ground.

Hell, just down the street in Miami and St Pete, most proposed towers get built, unlike in Orlando, where proposed towers are usually only to sell the plot of land and don’t typically ever see the light of day.

[dcluley98]

Ok, I get it. It is still "Orlando sized" and that is somewhat disappointing. It is on a scale of a Sky-house, Modera, Society, and the Hotel at S+ED.  Typical Orlando stuff, not a mega-block or tall project. 

I am just hoping we get CSP II - The Edge started soon. I actually really like that project (especially for Baker Barrios). Still nothing on that site. 

[GregoryMCSE]

19 minutes ago, dcluley98 said:

Ok, I get it. It is still "Orlando sized" and that is somewhat disappointing. It is on a scale of a Sky-house, Modera, Society, and the Hotel at S+ED.  Typical Orlando stuff, not a mega-block or tall project. 

I am just hoping we get CSP II - The Edge started soon. I actually really like that project (especially for Baker Barrios). Still nothing on that site. 

CSP II - The Edge  Is the one I am really hoping for. 

[JFW657]

52 minutes ago, GregoryMCSE said:

CSP II - The Edge  Is the one I am really hoping for. 

Same here. 

[jrs2]

16 hours ago, Uncommon said:

Hell, just down the street in Miami and St Pete, most proposed towers get built, unlike in Orlando, where proposed towers are usually only to sell the plot of land and don’t typically ever see the light of day.

yep...unfortunately for Orlando.  Good for Miami, and I always hope that their good fortune will spill over to O-Town; and I am hoping Brightline is a catalyst for that to occur (sooner than later)

Oh, and regarding St. Pete, they seem to have turned the corner and created their own thing and demand for it.  I really thought DTO made that turn during the Boom and the post-BOOM...but...

Edited April 1 by jrs2

[IAmFloridaBorn]

2 hours ago, GregoryMCSE said:

CSP II - The Edge  Is the one I am really hoping for. 

I had high hopes on this one, especially since they broke ground, but we have not seen any movement since 2023, which is unfortunate because I don't have any other reason to go to downtown Orlando

[dcluley98]

Permit for CSP II was last updated December 2023.  The Foundations/Underground and Vertical Construction permits are currently listed as "On Hold" with payments due to release hold.  They had said first half of this year, but I'm not getting my hopes up yet. 

[Ivanhoe]

I happened to be in New Rochelle NY over the weekend and was getting envy from what they’ve accomplished over the last few decades. 

[Uncommon]

10 hours ago, Ivanhoe said:

I happened to be in New Rochelle NY over the weekend and was getting envy from what they’ve accomplished over the last few decades. 

Same, though not for New Rochelle, never been. But I would find myself visiting other places and lamenting why Orlando couldn’t do the same. Then one day I just decided to move. I still want the best for Orlando because it feels like home, but it’s so behind so many other cities.

[orlandocity87]

On 3/27/2024 at 5:55 PM, jrs2 said:

...because FTL and Broward are way bigger than Orlando and Orange...

Broward County: 1.9 million / Fort Lauderdale: 183k
Orange County: 1.4 million / Orlando: 316k

Orlando is also the epicenter of the region with a metro population of 2.6 million. We're not competing with West Palm Beach or Miami.

I don't see how a couple blocks of six-story buildings with one or two 24-story towers are unrealistic. Plus, Hines did the Dr. Phillips Center, so we've seen that caliber of development in downtown Orlando before. 

[IAmFloridaBorn]

1 hour ago, orlandocity87 said:

Broward County: 1.9 million / Fort Lauderdale: 183k
Orange County: 1.4 million / Orlando: 316k

Orlando is also the epicenter of the region with a metro population of 2.6 million. We're not competing with West Palm Beach or Miami.

I don't see how a couple blocks of six-story buildings with one or two 24-story towers are unrealistic. Plus, Hines did the Dr. Phillips Center, so we've seen that caliber of development in downtown Orlando before. 

Didnt know we were that close to Broward. 

We wont catch them but its very interesting.

[orlandocity87]

Orlando and Orange County as a whole have nearly doubled in population since 1990. Unfortunately, we kept building suburbs like it was the 70s or 80s—and mostly still do.

[jrs2]

3 hours ago, orlandocity87 said:

Broward County: 1.9 million / Fort Lauderdale: 183k
Orange County: 1.4 million / Orlando: 316k

Orlando is also the epicenter of the region with a metro population of 2.6 million. We're not competing with West Palm Beach or Miami.

I don't see how a couple blocks of six-story buildings with one or two 24-story towers are unrealistic. Plus, Hines did the Dr. Phillips Center, so we've seen that caliber of development in downtown Orlando before. 

I agree, but the advantage FTL has is money, and, a collective mindset for the region that they need to build more dense because they are landlocked against The Everglades.  But money is the key.  Money and demand.

Also, competition.  When local entities like Advent and Darden build major offices in the suburbs, that speaks volumes about what they think about DTO.  Harcourt Brace used to be here- at SeaWorld.  Travelers left DTO a decade ago.  Other companies left also.  And its not like DTO is getting bad national press either...  Banks are always a sure tenant in DTO....

Just look at CV.  Modera and EA's HQ? Suburban office park-class size and design...  in a development that was supposed to be about a highly dense vertical development...

[IAmFloridaBorn]

1 hour ago, orlandocity87 said:

Orlando and Orange County as a whole have nearly doubled in population since 1990. Unfortunately, we kept building suburbs like it was the 70s or 80s—and mostly still do.

More than doubled. 

[jrs2]

3 hours ago, orlandocity87 said:

Orlando and Orange County as a whole have nearly doubled in population since 1990. Unfortunately, we kept building suburbs like it was the 70s or 80s—and mostly still do.

I've never worked in city govt, so I am not familiar with what marketing mechanisms they have and use.  But, the CVB has and/or had been marketing the region for conventions and they drew a lot of business.  I think DTO needs a task force to push for companies to relocate here in part or in whole.  I don't think these companies moving to downtown Nashville with all that new construction have been doing so in a vacuum. Sometimes I feel like the City's strategy is to fund big projects and hope companies take notice.  That may work for MCO, ala building new gates, but for a downtown there has to be much more... 

[orlandocity87]

One major issue is the constant fight between the City of Orlando and Orange County. In most other places, the county is a couple unincorporated communities who want to pay less taxes or live more rurally. Counties should be homesteads, farmlands, and nature preserves, almost acting like an urban boundary. 

But in Orlando's case, they put the convention center and university in the County. Then they allowed unbridled development for anyone who could afford the land. What makes this extra unfortunate is that the Orange County code is really weak. For decades, anybody wanting to build a subdivision or strip mall could just submit a "Planned Development" application and basically create their own planning standards. Now we have county residents expecting city-like amenities while paying less taxes.

It's a shame, really, because Central Florida has so many beautiful old communities that could have developed into walkable cities surrounded by nature and citrus groves. Instead, these communities just blend together into a sea of car-dependent development. Counties take such a huge portion of the cities' development demand that we're left with a situation where a few blocks of six-story buildings downtown seems ambitious.