Richmond Region Transportation

[heykey4]

It seems like Richmond will be years and years away from any kind of mass transit involving rail. I think it's due to the area having a very car dependent culture. Plus no government shows an interest in any of the jurisdictions. As far as I know.

Could the high speed line coming through encourage use of rail locally? Or will it forever be a topic for discussion in the academic sense?

[D_C]

It seems like Richmond will be years and years away from any kind of mass transit involving rail. I think it's due to the area having a very car dependent culture. Plus no government shows an interest in any of the jurisdictions. As far as I know.

Could the high speed line coming through encourage use of rail locally? Or will it forever be a topic for discussion in the academic sense?

I would bet that with the liberals moving down here and the area becoming more and more liberal, we are doomed to continue on our current path of car-dominated transportation. The rising fuel costs will be offset with grants and state handouts so everyone can continue to drive their gas-hogs. It's the liberal way. If you can't afford something, then all you have to do is cry loud enough and the state will come to your rescue.

[journiyin]

I would bet that with the liberals moving down here and the area becoming more and more liberal, we are doomed to continue on our current path of car-dominated transportation. The rising fuel costs will be offset with grants and state handouts so everyone can continue to drive their gas-hogs. It's the liberal way. If you can't afford something, then all you have to do is cry loud enough and the state will come to your rescue.

I hate to poke holes in your argument, but with that thinking, the current republican ruled state house should be banging down doors to get a mass transit plan approved. Now that to me seems the exact opposite of what they are thinking... somehow I can't see a Republican liking to admit that light rail is a good idea...

[wrldcoupe4]

I don't know many "liberals" that are opposed to mass transit. I can see where they may want grants and state handouts, but for investing in our public transit infrastructure, not to continue the status quo.

[Henry]

Check out this guy's idea (third letter): http://www.inrich.com/cva/ric/opinion/lett...07-13-0057.html

[heykey4]

Regardless of whether republicans or democrats are for or against it (I vote republican and would welcome an efficient, dependable mass transit system in the Richmond area); for some reason the leaders are not 100% for it. Sure we've heard them talk it up and all, but if they really had a desire to implement it, there would be more serious talk.

Sure it is a huge expense to get going and I really don't know the demand for it around here. It may be one of those things that the demand will not appear until the train does. I don't know.

I also wonder if it would be prudent to try to link the southside of Hampton Roads with Richmond metro. Amtrak goes to Newport News then you catch a bus to VA Beach, but a line running from Richmond - Petersburg - Norfolk - Virginia Beach may be handy. I think the high speed rail folks may be looking at that, but it seems that if VDOT is working to turn 460 into an expressway from Petersburg to Chesapeake, they could factor in the need for a rail line...unless CSX or Norfolk Southern permit use of their tracks. But my knowledge on either plan (high speed rail or the 460 expressway) is sketchy at best.

[Shakman]

Check out this guy's idea (third letter): http://www.inrich.com/cva/ric/opinion/lett...07-13-0057.html

Now there is someone using there head. Just to modify the idea, it would make sense to include a stop in Fredericksburg.

It may cost billions to build, but it could save billions long term.

Edited July 14, 2008 by Shakman

[burt]

I left Richmond for NYCity yesterday on the 5:30PM Amtrak train (late, of course) from Main Street Station. While the interior of MSS is fantastic, I wonder if it will not be an insurmountable task to transform the rail facilities to practical usage. There is a single track on each of the trestles bookending the station and only the eastern trestle is presently used for passenger traffic. However, Amtrak has scheduled trains in each direction within minutes of one another. The Newport News bound train from Boston is scheduled for a 5:12PM arrival while the northbound NY/Boston train is due at 5:30PM. The result is that one or the other train has to idle in the yards to await passage of the other -- unless, in the unlikely situation, both are on time.

Vast improvements, including reconstruction of snub ended trackage within the shed, will have to be made if east coast high speed and other services ever utilize the facility, IMO.

It still takes 25 minutes to negotiate the tracks between MSS via Acca Yard to Staples Mill suburban station.

I overheard a conversation on board between some Ashland residents and an official who had been in Richmond to discuss the Acca Yard/Ashland problem, and he said that very serious consideration is being given to the Buckingham RR line (formerly Chesapeake & Ohio mainline) between MSS and Doswell Junction, about 5 miles north of Ashland, where high speed trains would join the existing old RF&P route to Washington. He said that with some realignment and major reconstruction, they anticipate speeds of up to 90 mph from MSS to Doswell Junction and then up to 110 mph north from Doswell. The bad news is that it would cost about $200 million more than the present Acca Yard/Ashland route.

For those interested in numbers, I counted 19 travelers deboarding the Newport News bound train and 20 of us got on the northbound train at MSS.

[heykey4]

I left Richmond for NYCity yesterday on the 5:30PM Amtrak train (late, of course) from Main Street Station. While the interior of MSS is fantastic, I wonder if it will not be an insurmountable task to transform the rail facilities to practical usage. There is a single track on each of the trestles bookending the station and only the eastern trestle is presently used for passenger traffic. However, Amtrak has scheduled trains in each direction within minutes of one another. The Newport News bound train from Boston is scheduled for a 5:12PM arrival while the northbound NY/Boston train is due at 5:30PM. The result is that one or the other train has to idle in the yards to await passage of the other -- unless, in the unlikely situation, both are on time.

Vast improvements, including reconstruction of snub ended trackage within the shed, will have to be made if east coast high speed and other services ever utilize the facility, IMO.

It still takes 25 minutes to negotiate the tracks between MSS via Acca Yard to Staples Mill suburban station.

I overheard a conversation on board between some Ashland residents and an official who had been in Richmond to discuss the Acca Yard/Ashland problem, and he said that very serious consideration is being given to the Buckingham RR line (formerly Chesapeake & Ohio mainline) between MSS and Doswell Junction, about 5 miles north of Ashland, where high speed trains would join the existing old RF&P route to Washington. He said that with some realignment and major reconstruction, they anticipate speeds of up to 90 mph from MSS to Doswell Junction and then up to 110 mph north from Doswell. The bad news is that it would cost about $200 million more than the present Acca Yard/Ashland route.

For those interested in numbers, I counted 19 travelers deboarding the Newport News bound train and 20 of us got on the northbound train at MSS.

Over the fourth of July I took the train to NYC....leaving Staples Mill though. That station was packed with passengers boarding the Newport News-Boston Northeast Regional. I'd estimate 75 - 100 people. This train was 10 mins late coming in but we got to NYC on time.

[burt]

Here's a story by Peter Bacque from today's inRich detailing plans and costs for updating train service in Virginia, including the Urban Crescent Express from Washington via Richmond to Newport News and Southeast High Speed Rail Washington to Raleigh via Richmond:

http://www.inrich.com/cva/ric/news.apx.-co...07-17-0120.html

Edited July 17, 2008 by burt

[Shakman]

burt - Interesting article. Perhaps the local governments can sell their respective locality names to big corps in order to raise money. How does the City of Phillp Morris, VA at Richmond sound???

Anyways, with the recent transportation bill shot to peices, I doubt our State Reps will agree to some type of funding soon on any transportation issue... (I'm still fuming over that mess.)

In other trasportation news, most of us are aware that GRTC won some bragging rights relative to its mass transit system. Well according to an inrich.com article, GRTC may be eliminating some of its routes. The link to the inrich.com article names those routes:

http://www.inrich.com/cva/ric/news.apx.-co...07-17-0190.html

I find the elimination of some of these routes quite puzzling. Does anyone know if these are under performing routes?

[journiyin]

burt - Interesting article. Perhaps the local governments can sell their respective locality names to big corps in order to raise money. How does the City of Phillp Morris, VA at Richmond sound???

Anyways, with the recent transportation bill shot to peices, I doubt our State Reps will agree to some type of funding soon on any transportation issue... (I'm still fuming over that mess.)

In other trasportation news, most of us are aware that GRTC won some bragging rights relative to its mass transit system. Well according to an inrich.com article, GRTC may be eliminating some of its routes. The link to the inrich.com article names those routes:

http://www.inrich.com/cva/ric/news.apx.-co...07-17-0190.html

I find the elimination of some of these routes quite puzzling. Does anyone know if these are under performing routes?

They are under-performing according to the news report I heard on the radio this morning.

[D_C]

http://www.inrich.com/cva/ric/news.apx.-co...07-23-0143.html

GRTC looks to trim the fat a bit.

[burt]

At least a few people are discussing regional transportation even if Mr. Hazlett says better bus service in Henrico is unlikely given his profound knowledge of county residents' wishes.

From today's inRich:

http://www.inrich.com/cva/ric/news.apx.-co...09-04-0148.html

Edited September 4, 2008 by burt

[Cadeho]

Who needs buses? Bring back our rail system!

[Icetera]

Who needs buses? Bring back our rail system!

Yes, please.

[eandslee]

Yes, please.

Makes me jealous to hear that Virginia Beach has begun construction of their light rail system, the Tide. I wish Richmond would get something together like this. Just think of the economic impact this would have on a good route! I'm sure it will be a boon for VB.

[rusthebuss]

Makes me jealous to hear that Virginia Beach has begun construction of their light rail system, the Tide. I wish Richmond would get something together like this. Just think of the economic impact this would have on a good route! I'm sure it will be a boon for VB.

are you jealous of the traffic as well? You guys have hardly any traffic. Actually its Norfolk not Vabeach.

Edited September 9, 2008 by rusthebuss

[wrldcoupe4]

are you jealous of the traffic as well? You guys have hardly any traffic. Actually its Norfolk not Vabeach.

I'd love to see light rail in this area, but the traffic rus brings up is one of the main reasons they received funding for the project. a lack of congestion can be a double-edged sword.

[Icetera]

I'd love to see light rail in this area, but the traffic rus brings up is one of the main reasons they received funding for the project. a lack of congestion can be a double-edged sword.

Damn those well planned roads!

[burt]

Light rail on a direct route from Short Pump Town Center to City Hall along Broad Street would attract a lot of riders. The approximately 15-mile line would be pretty unique. Is there another city that has a light rail system confined to one street which connects major shopping; Fortune 1000 headquarters; office parks; Universities; museums; art district; government centers and entertainment venues?

Sounds like a winner to me.

[eandslee]

Light rail on a direct route from Short Pump Town Center to City Hall along Broad Street would attract a lot of riders. The approximately 15-mile line would be pretty unique. Is there another city that has a light rail system confined to one street which connects major shopping; Fortune 1000 headquarters; office parks; Universities; museums; art district; government centers and entertainment venues?

Sounds like a winner to me.

I agreee, Burt. Good luck getting something like this funded, however...unless a private company came in to do it (highly unlikely). Right now, it's just a pipe dream. I'm dreaming away....

[rusthebuss]

I agreee, Burt. Good luck getting something like this funded, however...unless a private company came in to do it (highly unlikely). Right now, it's just a pipe dream. I'm dreaming away....

I'm not trying to kill your dream but you should see what the traffic is like here. You guys may have more workers downtown but we have the worlds largest navalbase here that adds to the traffic, as well as a huge container terminal. You have to pass through 5 tunnels to get around. You guys have typically gotten the roads you needed but the state has tried to pass the cost to us to profit off the shipping terminals, which happen to be owned by the state. We get no revenues for the terminals. So you can see why we are upset at Richmond(State) here. It was shown that you guys pay less to maintain vehicles there than we do due to poor roads and sitting in traffic.

Edited September 10, 2008 by rusthebuss

[wrldcoupe4]

There's been talk recently of creating a stronger regional authority that would be responsible for transit improvements throughout the region (Burt links to it above). Not only is it an awesome opportunity to strengthen regionalism, but it's also a way for us to make things like light rail from MSS to Short Pump less of a pipe dream. This idea was floated in last year's Crupi Report 2.0.

[heykey4]

There's been talk recently of creating a stronger regional authority that would be responsible for transit improvements throughout the region (Burt links to it above). Not only is it an awesome opportunity to strengthen regionalism, but it's also a way for us to make things like light rail from MSS to Short Pump less of a pipe dream. This idea was floated in last year's Crupi Report 2.0.

It would seem that as far as light rail for Metro Richmond is concerned, we're a victim of the times. There's no money, state or federal, to put towards it....for now.

However, I wonder about a demand for such an endeavor. If it were something that would make money, no doubt private industry would have tried it already (well, in this century anyway. they did in the late 19th/early 20th). However, if it's more like a "if you build it, they will come" attitude...then it'll take forever.

As much as I would enjoy boarding a train in Mechanicsville bound for Chester, I don't know how the majority of Metro Richmonders feel about such a project. Certainly there's a demand in pockets of the area, but is there an overall demand? I suspect if there were, then this topic would be at the forefront of the politicians' minds.