Magicfan95

Just to note UCF has had some interest in the old TDW, but I think it's wearing off. The school wants to try and rid a commutter image and putting campus buildings off campus tends to do that. As for the arena, there is no way it's going downtown in the MIDDLE of everything. Parking is a major money maker for these venues and by building the venue in such an area your limiting the immediate parking drastically. A more realistic location will be on the outskirts of downtown, as was mentioned recently Dyer and co. are planning to announce the exact areas soon. As for the Sentinel, the Tribune Co. is one of the stingiest companies on the planet. So long as the current Sentinel offices meet their needs, they aren't moving.

JRS, both Tampa and Miami have had more growth since their arenas have been built than any period beforehand. Bayside was there and most built however, it's growth skyrocketed in 2000 when several projects were planned and many condos have been built and are planned. The Bayside marketplace was fully opened in 2001. Tampa was a bunch of dry docks and a bunch of nothing when St. Pete Times Forum was announced in 1994. While the arena wasn't the sole venue of growth many have attributed it's location as being a major catalyst for growth. They have also said the Florida Aquirum was partly responsible, as it opened a a year before SPT Forum in 1995. Since then they have had several hotels, shops, and condos. There was planning for a channelside rennovation, which did not take off until after the building was planned and built. The Channelside Entertainment Complex was finished in 2001, along with the Marriott on the bay.

Speck, I won't argue that the arena would be a "magical" cure for downtown. However, nothing you build would be, be it a PAC, a Museum, a World Trade Center, Space needle, etc. That being said, more than any other project an arena would be a great catalyst for development. Take away how our current arena is situated and look how other venues are put together. The St. Pete Times Forum basically took old docks/piers in downtown Tampa and helped turn it into an area of shops, restaurants, bars, condos, etc. Was it the sole responsibility, no...but it was a MAJOR catalyst. Lets go to Miami, American Airlines Arena is built in an area of Miami that many believed to be very dangerous and unacceptable. Since then bars and restaurants have increased in the area as well as Condos and over living quarters...Thats right on the bay in downtown Miami! Finally Memphis, where the FedEx Forum was built right off Beale St. in an effort to increase business of local residents in the area. Which in it's short existence has been nothing but positive. Many new restaurants have opened as well as shops in the area, which will be followed by a Blues museum in the next few months. If done correctly an arena can be a catalyst for downtown development, everything from shops, restaurants, and condos will benefit. Ya we might not have a new concert everynight or some political convention, but there will be a renewed interest from outside groups to host events at the new O-rena because of the attractivness of the Orlando market and the new arena's ability to turn a profit.

Speck, Yes they have...but lets look at COMPETITION in the region. Jacksonville, Tampa, Miami, and Sunrise all have venues better suited for those respected events. Whereas Boise, ID has...Spokane, WA? Bismark, SD? Billings, MT and Albuquerque, NM has...El Paso, TX? One more point...poor management? Allen Johnson has been a miracle for the arena. There is nothing asethically pleasing nor adventagous to any performer...Have you been in the green room? I've seem Motel 6's with nicer areas... How about the locker rooms? I've seen HS locker rooms that were bigger. The Media room? looks like a small highschool cafeteria. Speck, I don't mind if you say your against the arena, that is your opinion. Please don't go using information that is off base to back your points thats all I ask.

Yes Speck, however, those cities also weren't jobbed of an NCAA 1st/2nd round to Jacksonville this past week because their venues weren't outdated to meet the competition in the area. Jacksonville...need I say more. We've lost concerts and now an NCAA tourny site to them...

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/...=orl-home-promo

No, the comissioners are voting at the end of the month. A 5 of 7 vote is needed to increase the tax. I think it will pass. Yes, it is very realistic. Orlando is at a point where they are losing concerts and other events because the venue is outdated. Recently they didn't get the NCAA 1st/2nd rounds in 2009 or 2010, instead they went to Jacksonville (seriously) and Miami. The arena is outdated and the city is noticing it...in their pockebooks.

Bianchi

You will never see a professional sports team out Disney's way ever again. The whole O-Rays debacle has blackballed Disney as a potential site for a baseball team. It is too far away from the population base of Orlando. You might have an argumeny on the northern side of of I-Drive.

NFL: Doubtful at this point, but I wouldn't rule it out. Wayne Weaver is getting restless in Jacksonville as his team is losing a lot of money and has had to cover parts of his stadium to assure sellouts and negate blackouts. New Orleans is probably as good as gone too. Unfortunatley the city might be working its way back to pre-Katrina life, however, many of their citizens are still living in houses with tarps on roofs, etc. It's going to be tough. Minnesota is still looking for a new football stadium and rumors have surrounded the team. All this means squat though as Los Angeles is the 1st in line for a team. MLS: This isn't far fetched, however, barring Title IX problems, they will be playing at UCF's new Stadium. It's better fitted for MLS at 45,000. NHL: Not going to happen, unlike the NFL the NHL which depends on all the fans they can have hurts when 2 markets possibly overlap (Tampa and Orlando) However, Orlando WILL get a AHL (AAA) team if the new arena is built. MLB: Just adding there is always the possibility, especially with the D-Rays and Marlins struggling the way they are for fans. Would baseball work in Orlando? Possibly, however it is definitly something the city could look into affter the tax is approved.

Its a great start Shardoon. Sad to see Rosen take the tax completely out of base and say it was merely created for the tourism industry. The text of the statute clearly lists it as a source of public entertainment and sports venues (which was done to stop taxing the locals on venues without their say). Miami has spent 2%, Tampa 1%, Duval 3%, and Orlando .5% (after this tax increase)

Shardoon, I wouldn't read too much into it. Mr. Rosen is merely trying to stand hard to make sure he can squeeze every penny he can. 1/2% will go to facilities barring some big event between now and the vote.

Should be interesting bic, I know the Magic fought this at 1st. However, I don't believe either team will be competing that hard with each other for fans.

I believe Kissimmee has a hockey team and a small arena league team.

The Preds play at the O-rena, and people at both the Tampa Bay Lightning and Florida Panthers have expressed interest in putting their AAA teams in Orlando. I would not be shocked if this happens with the new arena. Currently the TDW cannot host a hockey team as part of a settlement with David Warnocker over the Orlando Seals ouster. Minor League baseball will be back in Orlando by 2008, I will guarentee that. There have been a couple private entities who were willing to buy Tinker Field and upgrade it.

The arena on I-Drive would do nothing more than to shut the yap of the hoteliers. There has been a landowner from Atlanta who has offered his parcel for a new arena on Universal Blvd. Whether that happens is unknown. With the hoteliers coming out and saying they approve the tax increase and it's use it could show signs of the arena being located downtown. I'm sure most people including city officials know the falicies of putting the arena on I-Drive, however they also know where their funding is coming from. Should be interesting to say the least.

Unless the arena is being rennovated it will NOT be in its current location. Chances are it will be a few blocks down and closer to Church St. (to help support a rebirth) or in the I-Drive area. This is coming from people who are involved.

bic, I've been told both the arena and the PAC will be world class facilities. The rumor out there is the arena has a big donation coming what will shock people. This is from some reliable sources, whether it happens or not who knows. The state will give around 40-60 Million with DeVos (who has been speculated as the big donation) giving up to 100M (realisitically around 50M) leaving the county to give 300 mill to the project. Which will be plenty to fund an adequate state of the art venue. (The newest arena in the country was around $300) As for the PAC I would expect a world class facility, however, I wouldn't expect the early plans to be anything on par with what will happen. They want 900 Million for what they have planned. In reality the new PAC will be around 450 Million, with around 300 Million coming from the tourist tax (Which is about what they are projecting now) and the rest coming from various donors. Overall it will still be a world class venue that I cannot wait to see. (Miami's recent PAC cost $450M) As for the Citrus Bowl, they have a very very weak case. The Arena and PAC clearly have priority and both will get the money first because they have tenants that can fill them for more than 100 dates a year unlike the Citrus Bowl which is basing their whole plan on 3 (maybe 4) events a year. As much as I'd like to see the work done, unless they are able to convince an NFL team or make it in to a convertable baseball/football stadium and lure the D-rays it probably will have to find other sources to pay for their venue.

To add, all three facilities will be making presentations to city/county officials. Expect the Arena/PAC to get the most money.

Shardoon, It doesn't matter if the patterns don't bring it directly over downtown, the fact that the FAA, which is not trying to supress the development of Downtown Orlando, is saying that so long as there is an airport that does except big planes (even if one never lands there) that close to downtown there will be restrictions on height of building. It not just a plane hitting a building, its a building causing windsheer, it's a noise problem reflection off of buildings, and it also is a radar problem from the (outside) possbility of a radar misreading off one of the buildings. The FAA is only doing it's job. It is the reason why Orlando did not have any tall buildings for years.

Shardoon, it does not matter, big planes do land at the exectuive airport from time to time, and as long as that happens there will be no 450+ buildings downtown. The FAA has given a height limit for Orlando. I am going to trust their judgement, as they are the experts in the whole flight thing over people who want it repealed so we can have higher buildings. The city has been asked to do their own study and they have declined to do so. Meaning, 450 is probably the max height for a very very long time in downtown Orlando.

Someone brought up how close airports are to 1000 ft. mountains as compared to our downtown.

This is from Orlando Business Journal in 1998. "Pizzuti Cos. unveil redesign for their proposed Orlando City Center. The centerpiece is a 27-story tower topped by a 110-foot-tall open cube. Previously rejected by the Federal Aviation Administration as a flight hazard, the cube now stands two stories shorter." (I couldn't copy and paste Sentinel Article)

The difference between the mountain and a building is that if the plane hits the mountain only the people on the plane are dead. There is also the physics of the whole thing. A mountain pushes wind up, skyscrapers being at 90 degrees most the time can deflect wind in all sorts of directions. There is an FAA height restriction, can build above it, but no one will insure the building, as the FAA deems it unsafe. The city has said that this does not bother them, and just showed a lack of interest in getting it studied. The height info was in an Orlando Sentinel article dated Jan 31, 1997.

I believe the max height in Orlando is 441 and it has to be west of Orange Ave to meet that height. If you remember the Orlando City Center (Putuzzi) wanted to hit 500, then 480, then 450, then 441. Ultimately lack of interest/funding prevented the development. The FAA will not budge on that height limit and the city doesn't seem to care about such a limit either.