Drive for 'Center City' retail

[PuppiesandKittens]

14 minutes ago, atlrvr said:

Right...I lived in Back Bay of Boston.  If you re-read my post, I said downtown, which is the CBD.  Washington St is mostly restaurants and services at this point.  Macy's at downtown crossing is tragic.  Filenes Basement shuttered years ago.  They did open a Primark, but most destination retail is Back Bay.  Back Bay office is more like South End.  It's wedged between 2 residential areas, with most of the street retail in brownstone townhomes, as well as 2 enclosed malls that have no street presence.

Chicago retail is almost exclusively north of "The Loop" which is the office district, in more of a mix of mid-rise/high rise residential area.

 

And I lived in Cambridge.  There is still plenty of retail in Downtown Crossing, and Faneuil Hall is right next door.  And if you lived in Back Bay, you know that the John Hancock Center office building is a flagship office tower, like the Bank of America headquarters, but it has two malls and several department stores at its base.  

Each of these has many times the square footage of uptown Charlotte retail.  Same for downtown Philadelphia and The Loop.

The void of destination retail in uptown Charlotte is simply inexplicable.  Comparable areas, and even lots of areas with less desirable demographics, have far more.

Edited December 24, 2023 by PuppiesandKittens

[kermit]

The revival of this thread by  CLTDevelopment reminded me of the uptown (and Southend) retail story we were talking about here in 2016. At the time (the dawn of Legacy Union and lots of talk about mall-like retail there) we were tracking more than 1 million square feet of new retail planned (or actively discussed by developers) in uptown and Southend. IIRC this was nearly 2/3rds the size of Southpark.

I mention this because a) destination retail at Atherton Mill was clearly successful; b) Southend seems to be attracting the bulk of the new retail in Charlotte; c) the (still rumored) Wegman's power center at Clanton and d)  the Trammel Crow announcement on the pipe factory land suggests we might replace the loss of what was being discussed at Legacy Union.

Back in 2016 we hesitantly  talked about brick and mortar retail shifting to walkable urban areas as online retail reduced the consumer need for convenience-oriented retail activities. Seems like this "retail as entertainment" model is pretty well cemented into the post-pandemic world. Perhaps we are (finally) at the dawn of the urban retail era, with Southend / Gold District poised to become the new Southpark? (or perhaps its just another false start)

 

 

 

Edited March 19 by kermit

[CLT Development]

On 3/18/2024 at 3:47 PM, kermit said:

Wegman's power center at Clanton and d) 

Target anchored, and I really think this will be South End's first town center, and will bring a ton of retail to the area. If I was going to invest in Charlotte it would be near this center.

On 3/18/2024 at 3:47 PM, kermit said:

Gold District poised to become the new Southpark? (or perhpas its just another false start)

I think Gold District is poised to become a new bar district, with Mint connecting to Summit & Bland, with more spreading toward Winnifred and South Tryon. I don't see Gold District getting much in the way of experiential and softgoods retail. I also think the area around skiptown will start to feel like a bar district, there are more building conversions on the horizon. 

On 3/18/2024 at 3:47 PM, kermit said:

.I mention this because a) destination retail at Atherton Mill was clearly successful; b) Southend seems to be attracting the bulk of the new retail in Charlotte;

I really think future phases around the design center, the eventual replacement of Carolina Foods, upgrades to strips along South Blvd will lead to a pretty robust strollable retail hot spot.

Edited March 19 by CLT Development

[CLT Development]

On 3/18/2024 at 3:47 PM, kermit said:

Trammel Crow announcement on the pipe factory land suggests we might replace the loss of what was being discussed at Legacy Union.

Its definitely a possibility that TC sinks significant effort into bringing more retail to this area of uptown. I would also expect Tepper builds a Sports Betting mecca somewhere.

[CharlotteWkndBuzz]

15 minutes ago, CLT Development said:

I would also expect Tepper builds a Sports Betting mecca somewhere.

100%. Tepper has been keeping an eye out on sports betting becoming legal here for years. Mentioned it in his very first press conference too. I’m really jealous of Cary for their Sports & Social bar/resturant. Would love something like that Uptown at Tep’s entertainment/stadium district or near the Hornets arena. I mentioned this in another thread but with the hornets owners wanting to build a new practice facility on the adjacent lot, the old practice space could accommodate a large sportsbook and restaurant/bar. Think sportbooks can only be in approved facilities like BOA, spectrum center, etc?  This may be a perfect spot for Hornets owners to put one. I could also envision their new practice facility having a sportsbook instead. Yes, you can bet on your phone but you make it an experience. A destination. A state of the art retail sportsbook in uptown would be game changing for the area.  

[go_vertical]

50 minutes ago, CLT Development said:

Target anchored, and I really think this will be South End's first town center, and will bring a ton of retail to the area. If I was going to invest in Charlotte it would be near this center.

I haven't been paying close attention to this one, but is this rumored to go where site prep has been going on for the past several months beside the Circle K between 77 and Tryon?  And if not then what the heck is going on there because that site is pretty big.

Also, what's the likelihood that future phases at the design center still includes the residential tower at Worthington and Hawkins that preserves the original facade and was shown about a year or so ago?

[CLT Development]

5 hours ago, CharlotteWkndBuzz said:

100%. Tepper has been keeping an eye out on sports betting becoming legal here for years. Mentioned it in his very first press conference too. I’m really jealous of Cary for their Sports & Social bar/resturant. Would love something like that Uptown at Tep’s entertainment/stadium district or near the Hornets arena. I mentioned this in another thread but with the hornets owners wanting to build a new practice facility on the adjacent lot, the old practice space could accommodate a large sportsbook and restaurant/bar. Think sportbooks can only be in approved facilities like BOA, spectrum center, etc?  This may be a perfect spot for Hornets owners to put one. I could also envision their new practice facility having a sportsbook instead. Yes, you can bet on your phone but you make it an experience. A destination. A state of the art retail sportsbook in uptown would be game changing for the area.  

I think it'll be at the site of the practice facility its still on contiguous property owned by the stadium. Same could be done with Hornets current facility when the new one is built.

[SouthEndCLT811]

12 hours ago, go_vertical said:

I haven't been paying close attention to this one, but is this rumored to go where site prep has been going on for the past several months beside the Circle K between 77 and Tryon?  And if not then what the heck is going on there because that site is pretty big.

Also, what's the likelihood that future phases at the design center still includes the residential tower at Worthington and Hawkins that preserves the original facade and was shown about a year or so ago?

No, where the Business Park is at Clanton & Tryon

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