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The Renaissance at Carver Square

bic

By bic
in Orlando

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bic Burg

bic

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The Renaissance at Carver Square project is an approximately 293,000 square feet, 11 story, mixed use development. The Renaissance will include residential and office condominiums, restaurant and retail space, enclosed parking, and a 320 seat state of the art performing arts theatre.

It is located at the corners of West Church Street and Parramore in the Parramore community of Orlando.

The Carver Theatre is the central point and heart of the Renaissance at Carver Square Project. The Theatre will bring together many forms of the arts and will consist of a 300 seat

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mrh3 Hamlet

mrh3

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So, my honest professional opinion of a mixed-use spec glass and steel project coming out of the ground right now with residential condos, small tenant retail use, and office space is shows A LOT of hubris from the Mayor's office. Considering that the CRA money is there and that the BBIF and its off shoot are "guaranteeing" the funding shows a serious lack of understanding of financial markets. This project is in the middle of an area that will not attract the retail dollars or tenants that will make a project like this feasible.

Consider this, if we are (and I believe we are in the beginning of a prolonged recession-I am hearing estimates of upward of 5 years before the construction cycle kicks back up) there is going to be a lot of vacate top-notch space downtown Orlando with an existing amenity/infrastructure that will be leasing at firesale prices. Even assuming that in 2010 when this project is forecast to be ready for occupancy it quite a stretch of the imagination to assume that a business or an individual would choose to live or operate in a Class C location (Uptown is a B location) when the core of downtown is dirt cheap.

All investments are inherently risky. To announce a project of this magnitude utilizing tax payer dollars to be invested in mixed-use real estate in this market is reckless. Buddy Dyer should be ashamed of himself. If, however, he does go into this deal, should structure it as a recourse loan to a reputable developer and can help mitigate the risk of this deal. If Urban Trust wants an HQ so badly then they should assume the mortgage, they should should line up the developer and Orlando's tax payer money should be in a second position after the senior loan. Otherwise, it's just carelessness and a total disregard for what is important.

Build a homeless shelter with the money that doesn't charge people to sleep in it, Buddy. Address public nuisance #1.

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sunshine City

sunshine

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I think it should be built while the price is low. It creates construction jobs that we desperately needed. Plus, the city can get money back from the garage during Magic games. But, I would not just hand them 17 millions dollars, it can come as low cost loan, or the owner will have to pay the city back when the building increases in value. Furthermore, there is a community theatre involved. It is better than giving money to purely condo project.

And for the homeless, buy them bus tickets to send them back to where they come from.

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jack Burg

jack

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I had a chance to look at the deal thoroughly. The City shares 1st position with the lender. 60% contracts before the loan can be released. The money is a reimbursement to be paid over the construction period and two years after the project is complete. The retail and office condos are below market.

My fear is the office condos will not sell. Condos tend to target small businesses and are best suited for certain users that can have fixed space. I do not know who their tenants will be.

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mrh3 Hamlet

mrh3

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Sushine:

Who said it was cheap to build right now? Regarding the homeless... You're assumption is that Orlando doesn't generate it's own homeless population. I can't believe that a metro area with 2.5MM people doesn't have

Jack:

If you can't get the condo's to sell, or the retail to lease what's the investment rationale? Even if one is cautiously optimistic, one has to imagine that any senior lender would be brave to go first into this deal.

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jack Burg

jack

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It is a consortium of banks. Five total I believe. Imagine trying to get five banks to approve a deal. They are doing this as a community investment and because the City is bringing major cash. And it is less risky then a traditional for lease office building.

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prahaboheme City

prahaboheme

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This does sound like a great catalyst for the neighborhood (especially a neighborhood theater) but honestly, that looks like a single wide stacked on top of a double wide. This building is going to anchor the new Heritage Park--it needs to be easier on the eye.

For all its problems Parramore at least has some architectural styles to draw inspiration from; why did the architect ignore this? level of talent?

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bic Burg

bic

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This does sound like a great catalyst for the neighborhood (especially a neighborhood theater) but honestly, that looks like a single wide stacked on top of a double wide. This building is going to anchor the new Heritage Park--it needs to be easier on the eye.
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JRS1 Town

JRS1

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since this thread is about Parramore, maybe they should put a hospital there-- I know, it's overkill, but think about it-- ORHS and FH are major business nodes N & S of downtown. maybe that's what Parramore, to the west, needs... a hospital with supporting services and businesses could really do something in that neighborhood.

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Boomer136 Hamlet

Boomer136

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The web site seems to sell it as the new hub of a '20's-'30's Harlem re-imagining of Parramore. Its position along Church just east of the midpoint of the new arena and the Citrus Bowl, and pretty well centered between the 408 and the railroad tracks to the north lends a certain amount of hubbish-ness, if indeed that is a word. What this says about how desegregation's goals have fared and how our race still influences where we choose to live and work, I haven't discovered yet. But regardless, if there is perhaps a look to an urban version of Buddy's creative village, how great that would be.

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mrh3 Hamlet

mrh3

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Jack: Thanks for the insight. I guess we still have to make money and we still have to build. I like the project I guess we'll just have to see how the market handles it.

Praha/Bic: I agree with the architectural assessment. Parramore has those great balconies. It would have been nice to build off of that. I was in Montreal this past spring and Crescent Street has balconies three levels high on both sides of the street. Quite an experience to see the Quebecois getting sauced on a warm day.

Crescent 1

Crescent 2

Crescent 3

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JRS1 Town

JRS1

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You have to start somewhere. The fed courthouse, and FAMU took a baby step into Parramore. City View took another big step as does the new arena. This proposed project is a big step into the neighborhood because it extends the reach of new constructuion to the center of Parramore. It's just one more project, but it's the biggest gamble since City View on the West side of I-4 and I consider that another positive step. The homeless hanging around on the West side is a huge negative. I don't have an answer for that.
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