The State of Downtown Grand Rapids Retail

[GRDadof3]

Nice summary guys! Rhino, which building is the "one South of the Founders Building"? I'm trying to remember which building we were talking about.

One inexpensive fix that I think we all agreed on was dressing up the empty window displays. There was an update on the downtown marketing campaign at last month's DDA meeting, with a review of the minutes from that meeting planned for the May 9th meeting:

http://www.ci.grand-rapids.mi.us/download_...244b56efc02.pdf

The Downtown Alliance and the CVB requested $140,000 from the DDA: $50,000 for the Tim Allen radio campaign for the CVB, and $90,000 for the Downtown Alliance's campaign through Summer/Fall 07. The motion was approved. Perhaps part of that $90,000 could be spent on some kind of window dressing.

Downtown Alliance Contact page

[Veloise]

...

The Downtown Alliance and the CVB requested $140,000 from the DDA: $50,000 for the Tim Allen radio campaign for the CVB, and $90,000 for the Downtown Alliance's campaign through Summer/Fall 07. The motion was approved. Perhaps part of that $90,000 could be spent on some kind of window dressing.

...

By "window dressing" we mean something...anything...in the vacant display windows and storefronts. Colorful shopping bags with tissue paper poking out the tops. Products from adjacent businesses. Colorful posters or event materials. This could be seasonal or pertain to GR or the space or the building. (How about Adopt-A-Window?)

Well, almost anything. When the focal point of a retail window is a huge REALTOR® sign taped to the glass, it detracts from the space's appearance.

[joeDowntown]

Let me know when the next meeting is. I was 10 feet away from the meeting, but doing an interview. Sorry guys, I thought I'd get done in time to come over and talk.

Joe

[Veloise]

Let me know when the next meeting is. I was 10 feet away from the meeting, but doing an interview. Sorry guys, I thought I'd get done in time to come over and talk.

Joe

Thought that was you! (Didja think we were headed to a bar when we picked up and left??)

I suggested that the next one start at RPC so we're already there.

[jbr12]

I just saw this magazine this morning at our office. Thought it might be of interest to the wonderful UP folks

In this 26-page special report, Urban Land looks at what constitutes a great city, first, by polling ULI members and asking them to name and explain their favorite cities; then, by examining three very different cities: the

[Rhino6885]

Nice summary guys! Rhino, which building is the "one South of the Founders Building"? I'm trying to remember which building we were talking about.

I was referring to the courtyard just south of the Founders Trust building, but you mentioned that they're putting in a fountiain/monument or something of that nature. That extra sq. footage they added in the entrances to the storefronts could also be better utilized IMO, and there is a vacancy in the old Hallmark?.

[GRDadof3]

I was referring to the courtyard just south of the Founders Trust building, but you mentioned that they're putting in a fountiain/monument or something of that nature. That extra sq. footage they added in the entrances to the storefronts could also be better utilized IMO, and there is a vacancy in the old Hallmark?.

Oh right, this renovation of Campau Plaza. I believe it's supposed to start this summer to be finished in time for the Marriott opening.

[Rhino6885]

Last night, we parked on Ottawa near the Calder and walked towards Monroe Center. With the exception of the new Courthouse, that area id D-E-A-D. The ground level of the buildings surrounding the Calder are all transparent, but empty. That are would be great for some retail, as it joins the area north of Michigan and Pill Hill with the rest of downtown. When coming from 196, it's the first thing you are exposed to downtown. The Grande Vitesse is an icon for Grand Rapids, but it stands in the middle of a dated and empty part of downtown.

I'm sure this has been discussed before, but I figured I'd bring it up in this thread.

[GRDadof3]

We walked around downtown this evening and noted some areas like this. Here are some of the things that come to mind:

• The opening south of the Founders building. GRDad mentioned that it was getting a facelift, so could be good.
  
• The Ellis lot entrance between the Dog Pit and Tre Cugini. It's a waste of great space. Could be a park, infill, or number of other uses.
  
• Entrance to building occupied by Atwell Hicks has no signage or anything. It just looks like a vacant storefront.
  
• Vacancies in old Two Choppers and Van Hoeks Shoes
  
• Vacant space on both sides of Monroe Ctr. between Ottawa and Ionia (Old Fox's, Morton House, Riverbank Books)
  
• Old Market on north side of Monroe Ctr. accross from Grand Central Market. Huge space.
  
• Parking Lot between the BOB, TGI Fridays, and Ottawa.
  
• Other buliding entrances appear as if they are vacant storefronts instead of entrances to great work spaces.
  
• Kendall Building (next to Reynolds and Children's Museum) is vacant and boarded up
  
• JA building disjoins Heartside/Division Art District from CBD
  
• Dodds Music???
  
• Empty lot...duh, at Fulton & Division
  
• More vacancies/deteriorated buildings along Division
  
• Lot Behind JA building
  
• Keeler? Building north of the Civic Theater has vacancies/little retail
  

Everybody else feel free to add

Other observations:

Protruding signage would help throughout CBD. When you look north on Ottawa from Monroe Ctr., it just looks like a brick wall. You cannot see any signage for any businesses. The same can be said for other businesses on Monroe Ctr...until you get to Anginas, Little Bohemia, and Cafe Solace. Also, City Signs, only face the direction of oncoming traffic. So, if you are a pedestrian walking north on Ottawa, you just see green...no text or pictures. Furthermore, pedestrian maps only show building addresses and large organizations. There is no mention of specific businesses, restaurants, or retail stores to assist visitors and other consumers. Finally, Children's Museum has no signs that identify itself from the West/Southwest...unless you count the blue awnings.

The next day during lunch, I catalogued the things we talked about. Let me just state we're not criticizing, just trying to view downtown from a visitor's point of view, which is what the downtown campaign is trying to attract.

Looking from the epicenter at Monroe and Pearl, where many visitors downtown are first exposed to the retail environment. Monroe Center seems to be the natural choice (our 8th Street):

Looks good so far:

Hair Salon, eyeglass shop, not bad:

This looks like a hole in the fabric, an empty storefront with dead activity, when in fact it's an entrance to the office above. Could use something for sure:

The rest of the building looks OK (still looking for a clothing store or gift shop).

Very bad dead spot. Ellis could probably spare 6 parking space of this lot and this area could be greatly transformed into a nice urban park or eating area. Why is there auto access from Monroe Center here? I don't think I've ever seen anyone use this gate.

This looks good. Lots of activity at the pedestrian level:

Forgot to take a picture of the post office annex.

This looks like a vacant storefront, when again it is an entrance to Ledyard's inner area:

Watch repair, jewelry, luggage. Perhaps would use these every five years or so.

More food, more outdoor seating. It's clean and welcoming, but still no retail goods to speak of:

Vacant corner:

Vacant corner:

Anything noteworthy down that way? Notice the back of the wayfinding signs facing the other way, and the lack of "shingle" signs on the Ledyard tenants. You can't tell there are any shops along that stretch.

Can't tell. Guess I'll keep moving up Monroe Center.

More services, not many goods:

What's up with that building across the street? Are we in Flint?

No comment:

Whew, glad we made it past that other building. On to the next block (looks much better)

More to come later..

[GRDadof3]

Continuing on...

This direction seems like the "path of least resistance", or the next logical direction to travel:

This doesn't look too bad. The "low-cost" construction of the patio area leaves much to be desired:

Vacancy (and I can't find this place listed on CARWM):

And window display boxes that look like they're still in the 50's:

Ahh, goods!

At Monroe Center and Division. Looks like not much that way:

The Civic Theater looks great, but no retail:

Boarded up building over there, sidewalk sale, and no signs on the Children's Museum on this side of the building:

Nothing (yet) to tie Monroe Center to S. Division:

So heading back. The planters, benches and tree canopy look very nice.

Yikes..

Getting much better:

Look, an empty window with something in it:

Vacancy (and empty windows):

This one is blurry, but it's the wig shop (with absolutely no signage except on the door):

Intentionally skipping 65 Monroe Center for now.

Nothing that way:

Can't tell if there is anything that way:

This section is always quiet:

Absolutely unacceptable in my opinion (can this be deemed "blight" in its current condition and the property owner fined?):

This one too. Nice junk in the window:

Much better!

20 bonus points for Neihoff for having his doors open saying WELCOME!

Final chapter to come....

[Rizzo]

Beyond proving a point Dad, these are great pictures! I really appreciate the idea of having a small pocket park on the Ellis Lot right next to The GR Information Center.

Anyone know how many different property owners are represented on Monroe Center? I would also add, any of these retailers do advertising outside the immediate districts?

I don't see why Holland's experience can't apply here. Yes, Downtown is significantly much larger than Holland, but Monroe Center is also quite small and manageable -- something on Hollands scale, yes?

Edited May 6, 2007 by Rizzo

[GRDadof3]

Beyond proving a point Dad, these are great pictures! I really appreciate the idea of having a small pocket park on the Ellis Lot right next to The GR Information Center.

Anyone know how many different property owners are represented on Monroe Center? I would also add, any of these retailers do advertising outside the immediate districts?

I don't see why Holland's experience can't apply here. Yes, Downtown is significantly much larger than Holland, but Monroe Center is also quite small and manageable -- something on Hollands scale, yes?

I'd say definitely yes. I would guess there are far fewer retailers on Monroe Center than on 8th Street. There are just more retail bays on 8th due to the way the buildings are configured (smaller buildings, more bays). Monroe Center has four large towers (Blue Cross Blue Shield, Michigan National Tower, Morton House and Select Bank) that do not have a lot of ground floor "retail" space.

A few more, then a wrap up:

Old people shoes (?):

Vacancy:

Retail?

New museum shaping up:

End of the line and end of the tour:

If Monroe Center holds the best potential as the "retail hub" of downtown, there is a lot of work to do. You can lure all the people in the world to downtown, but with a few exceptions, they are going to be disappointed at what they find, IOHO. Perhaps it should be kept a secret until it gets cleaned up. If I had to compare Monroe Center to a local mall, I'd say it could be compared to North Kent before it was torn down. I would say it's not even as vibrant, clean (store window displays) and the tenant mix is not even as good as CenterPointe Mall at this point in time (for mall type retail goods). If you need lunch or want a nice dinner, it's one of the best areas in town.

Keep in mind all these pictures were taken at lunch on a weekday, not after 5:30 PM or on a Saturday or Sunday.

Now we know where we are. Where to go from here. Monroe Center is kept relatively clean and the architecture is great, so the potential is there:

A recap of 8th Street in downtown Holland

Here's that urban park/plaza in Holland that could easily be replicated at the front end of the Ellis lot:

Plant some trees, add some tables and more benches, a few grassy knolls:

[joeDowntown]

Though with Rosa Park Circle so close, don't you think a couple of new storefronts would actually be better, add more density, etc?

Great tour. The corner of Ionia is the toughest spot because you have the old MNB building, Morton House and the Select Bank building. All big with no retail.

Is Drink even around anymore or is that another vacancy?

I liked the use of sandwich board signs by the people actually trying to draw people into their stores.

Is 65 Monroe Center going to have any retail or is it all condos (with Virgin Soil's offices below ground)?

Joe

[starrfish]

It's awesome that you posted all these pics GRDad! Now anyone who didn't make the meeting can get a clear idea of what we observed. Seems like Monroe Center would have its own association...does anyone know? Perhaps after our group has a few more meetings, we could meet with them?

*fish

[Veloise]

It's awesome that you posted all these pics GRDad! Now anyone who didn't make the meeting can get a clear idea of what we observed. Seems like Monroe Center would have its own association...does anyone know? Perhaps after our group has a few more meetings, we could meet with them?

*fish

Monroe Center is part of the Downtown Alliance (the KIAS folks).

[Rhino6885]

Wow GRDad...nice work!

[starrfish]

We have our work cut out for us then. Or it will be really simple to propose some ideas and accomplish some things. Afterall, they did accept KIAS...the idea bar has been set pretty low!

*fish

Monroe Center is part of the Downtown Alliance (the KIAS folks).

[GRDadof3]

We have our work cut out for us then. Or it will be really simple to propose some ideas and accomplish some things. Afterall, they did accept KIAS...the idea bar has been set pretty low!

*fish

The Downtown Alliance is not so much a "property owners association", as it is a "downtown improvement district". They collect an assessment from downtown business owners to fund landscaping, cleaning and marketing (which paid for the Downtown Market Survey and Arts & Entertainment Strategy, and KIAS). You may have seen their white pickup trucks driving around and guys picking up trash around downtown. I'm pretty sure they don't have anything to do with actual property upkeep regulations, or bylaws like you'd find at a mall.

It should be fairly easy to meet with them as it is a small group represented by a board made up of several volunteers.

Though with Rosa Park Circle so close, don't you think a couple of new storefronts would actually be better, add more density, etc?

Sure, that would be the ultimate solution Joe, but I just don't see that happening anytime soon until the current 35% retail vacancy comes down to 10 or 15% or so. At least in the meantime it could be converted into more aesthetically pleasing space. starrfish and I talked about building a false building facade along that to create the look of continuity.

Drink is still open FWIW:

[Veloise]

...

Vacancy (and I can't find this place listed on CARWM):

And window display boxes that look like they're still in the 50's:

These are some of the blank display windows I mentioned a few posts back. Give me a fraction of a percent of the KIAS budget and turn me loose in a dollar or fabric store, and I'll jazz this up for ya.

Ahh, goods!

...

When we walked this, Dad said LB and the shoe place should be paid to be here, as they are almost single-handedly revitalizing Monroe Center.

[GRDadof3]

These are some of the blank display windows I mentioned a few posts back. Give me a fraction of a percent of the KIAS budget and turn me loose in a dollar or fabric store, and I'll jazz this up for ya.

When we walked this, Dad said LB and the shoe place should be paid to be here, as they are almost single-handedly revitalizing Monroe Center.

And when we walked past, they were the only store we saw (other than cafes and eateries) that was FULL of shoppers. Every effort should be made to keep them around, IMO (free tax credits toward rent maybe?).

[joeDowntown]

When is the next meeting? I'll be in London next week and it will be interesting to see how the mix of retail works over there. I definitely want to go to the next meeting!

Joe

[GRDadof3]

When is the next meeting? I'll be in London next week and it will be interesting to see how the mix of retail works over there. I definitely want to go to the next meeting!

Joe

We thought maybe in a couple of weeks or so.

After talking about the infill possibilities at the Ellis lot, I worked on this illustration this weekend (which my kids enjoyed watching and helped me add things to it). It would essentially be an urban park/plaza with tables and benches, grassy "study" knolls, brick pavers and a number of large trees. The main feature would be a "false building facade" that would give the appearance of urban infill (temporarily possibly until demand was hot enough to infill this spot), and create a visual link between the two buildings. I figure cost would run about the same as the LC Promenade ($500,000 give or take) since this is much smaller but contains a built structure. Ellis would have to part with his Monroe Center gate and give up 10 parking spaces. The lot is assessed at about $360,000, so land cost and foregone revenue for Ellis might add another $2 - $300,000 to the price. I'm just speculating on the costs though.

I couldn't decide whether to make it as tall as Ledyard, or as tall as the building to the West, so I split the difference and lined it up with the cornice work on Ledyard. The Italian theme comes from starrfish's "Roman ruins" idea and Tre Cugini next door. The "facade" would be built entirely of brick on a steel frame:

Overhead site plan, with paths, greenspace, benches and tables. I figure some people don't like to eat in the wide-open space of Rose Parks Circle:

Or add outdoor sidewalk patios to it.

The times I've traveled, the things that really stand out in my memory are things that were very unconventional. Has anyone seen something similar to this before?

[Veloise]

...

Overhead site plan, with paths, greenspace, benches and tables. I figure some people don't like to eat in the wide-open space of Rose Parks Circle:

...

Great minds...was looking at those bare open cafe tables and chairs this week, and thinking about umbrellas or portable trees. One of the nice things about that furniture is: no one cares if you re-arrange it (or not), or put it back (or not). Almost a public art display. But I will not sit in the sun.

[walker]

...I couldn't decide whether to make it as tall as Ledyard, or as tall as the building to the West, so I split the difference and lined it up with the cornice work on Ledyard. The Italian theme comes from starrfish's "Roman ruins" idea and Tre Cugini next door. The "facade" would be built entirely of brick on a steel frame:

I suppose it would be dreaming to think the best use of that parking lot space would be as a building with retail. Maybe the fa

[GRDadof3]

I suppose it would be dreaming to think the best use of that parking lot space would be as a building with retail. Maybe the fa