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Transit 2020

quente

By quente
in Providence

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Pseudo_Work Hamlet

Pseudo_Work

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Pardon me for being naive, but has anyone brought up the idea of electric buses a la San Francisco? I've been taking them often while visiting, and they seem to be a nice compromise between buses and streetcars. They're cleaner, more efficient, and more user friendly than buses, without the expense and hassle of laying track.

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runawayjim Metropolis

runawayjim

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Pardon me for being naive, but has anyone brought up the idea of electric buses a la San Francisco? I've been taking them often while visiting, and they seem to be a nice compromise between buses and streetcars. They're cleaner, more efficient, and more user friendly than buses, without the expense and hassle of laying track.
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Cotuit Megalopolis

Cotuit

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Pardon me for being naive, but has anyone brought up the idea of electric buses a la San Francisco? I've been taking them often while visiting, and they seem to be a nice compromise between buses and streetcars. They're cleaner, more efficient, and more user friendly than buses, without the expense and hassle of laying track.
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Cotuit Megalopolis

Cotuit

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True, about the light rail. I was just thinking as more of an interim system. Before we put rails down Broadway, we can start by just stringing up the wires and running electric buses, until we decide to make the investment in light rail.
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bhooley Whistle-Stop

bhooley

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I could see using the hybrid buses Boston uses on the Silver Line in the East Side rail tunnel (if we ever re-open that). We could have buses running on diesel engines coming from all up and down the East Bay converging on the rail tunnel, then switching to electric to run through the tunnel and into the city. That way we don't need to string wires all over the East Bay, but can have buses running through the tunnel and Downtown fume free.
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mental757 Burg

mental757

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I could see using the hybrid buses Boston uses on the Silver Line in the East Side rail tunnel (if we ever re-open that). We could have buses running on diesel engines coming from all up and down the East Bay converging on the rail tunnel, then switching to electric to run through the tunnel and into the city. That way we don't need to string wires all over the East Bay, but can have buses running through the tunnel and Downtown fume free.
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  • 3 weeks later...
frymasterspeck Hamlet

frymasterspeck

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Just a quick reminder that the Providence & Beyond cafe on Transit is this Thursday (12/11) morning from 8:30 - 11:30 at New Commons, 56 Pine Street, Providence. This page has some links to articles that we're using as background.

Our panel is Garry Bliss of various state and private posts, and Thom Deller, planner for the City of Providence.

I can offer a handful of spots to UPers who want to see what Providence & Beyond is about. To RSVP, please DM me or email speck22 [at] gmail [dot] com.

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Pseudo_Work Hamlet

Pseudo_Work

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And it was such a lovely day for a drive, too.

If you scan the live blog notes, you'll see where I ran out to feed my parking meter. (Parking meter cards = excellent.) Ha, ha, ha, too late. $25 ticket. Serves me right.

And, BTW, the following meme was floating around discussion of the street cars: it's the kind of investment/commitment that can change attitudes and perceptions both in the city/state and as we're viewed from afar. It could potentially change behavior, too. Tracks in the ground are seen by the development community as a far greater commitment than a bus system which is easily cut/minimized.

All next year, P & B will focus on the living local economy. As always, input from the UP community is welcomed.

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frymasterspeck Hamlet

frymasterspeck

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Oh, yeah, the reason I stopped by...

I read this in a Reuters story about Pawtucket:

They are considering a big public works program, a consolidation of state services and possibly the nation's only tax on residents for each mile they drive.

Under that tax proposal, residents would have to report their mileage and pay a fee when registering their vehicles every two years.

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f1rehead Whistle-Stop

f1rehead

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Realistically, this plan penalizes people who have to drive long distances due to a lack of public transportation or because they work out of their cars (salespeople, contractors, etc). Not to mention it's a bureaucratic nightmare. Are they going to require residents to take their cars in every year so someone can read the odometer? The VIN inspection is annoying enough already.

I predict a huge outcry, following by people moving if it passes. I don't mind paying my fair share of taxes, but if the process of determining the tax became burdensome, I'd move. Especially if I were a renter, like a lot of Pawtucket residents.

This isn't the worst idea ever, but it's up there.

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runawayjim Metropolis

runawayjim

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Realistically, this plan penalizes people who have to drive long distances due to a lack of public transportation or because they work out of their cars (salespeople, contractors, etc). Not to mention it's a bureaucratic nightmare. Are they going to require residents to take their cars in every year so someone can read the odometer? The VIN inspection is annoying enough already.

I predict a huge outcry, following by people moving if it passes. I don't mind paying my fair share of taxes, but if the process of determining the tax became burdensome, I'd move. Especially if I were a renter, like a lot of Pawtucket residents.

This isn't the worst idea ever, but it's up there.

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Pseudo_Work Hamlet

Pseudo_Work

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It said it would be checked and reported when you got your state inspection every 2 years. I agree, it does suck for those who have a long commute or use their cars for work (though I would hope they'd have some way of getting a deduction if you use it for work). It's more regressive than the tax on the value of the car, but I am of the opinion that the more driving you do, the more you should pay in taxes, though I suppose that can be handled through the gas tax, which I think should be higher.

I don't see it realistically passing, though I hope it brings more discussion about better public transportation options.

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runawayjim Metropolis

runawayjim

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I don't see it passing either, although frankly I'd be a bit excited if it did. I'm pretty sure we'd be the only state with such a progressive driving policy. I feel like there would be the distinct danger of ending up in a similar situation with this tax as we have with the gas tax and RIPTA. If we tax people for driving in order to maintain the roads, then the less people drive, the less money there is to maintain roads that are bound to deteriorate whether people are driving them or not. I also agree that people would probably move, but in a certain way I sort of view such a phenomenon as a purging of a lot of the people that are holding us back at the moment (no offense to anyone here).
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Cotuit Megalopolis

Cotuit

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I think the big argument (well a big argument) would be, why should RI be allowed to tax me for miles driven out of state since the tax is to determine how much my car contributes to road wear and tear, and how would you be able to tell how many miles I drove in Rhode Island vs. out. Also, only residents have to pay, how are commuters from out of state or tourists taxed for use of our roads.

In theory, I'm not against it, but I don't think it is not the most elegant or egalitarian solution.

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  • 4 weeks later...
f1rehead Whistle-Stop

f1rehead

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Over on Providence Daily Dose, Matt Jerzyk posted a list of all the items in the Mayor's Stimulus Wish List (remember the old days when you could get the Sears Stimulus Wish List Catalog? Good times.) and the line item for streetcars is for $20M.

I don't know much about infrastructure costs but they usually seem to be, what's the word?, "high", yes that's it, "high". Twenty million dollars for a streetcar system sounds that other thing, "low". The city doesn't have any money to contribute to that, so the $20M has to be most of the cost.

Can we really get a streetcar system for that little money? Will it look like one of those tiny trains Ricky Stratton had in his living room?

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