Central Lansing Construction and Development.

[asics]

It's resurging, I'd say it's 5 or less years behind GR and maybe down a few philanthrepists, but it is doing good. We are just breaking through our first wave of redevelopment and beginning this year I would hope to see some larger projects get off the ground. One thing that has helped Lansing is the office situation downtown, it has been very good for going on 20 years, it started to lag a couple years ago but even with a 160k sq ft building built last year at high vacancy rates it was quickly filled along with most other class A space downtown. And the State isn't the sole reason for Lansing's good office market, altough it is the largest part of it. Lansing is headquarters for several insurance companies and plenty of lobbyists and organizations.

Does Lansing have enough population to see the same sorts of gains as Grand Rapids is seeing currently?

And in Five years will lansing have the same sort of buzz that is being generated in GR? I'm interested in what everyone thinks because I think that with Lansing being the state capitol and having a huge student population at it's doorstep, the potential should be exponential. It could become a mesh between what Ann Arbor is with it's student population and Grand Rapids is with it's authentic city feel.

[hood]

Does Lansing have enough population to see the same sorts of gains as Grand Rapids is seeing currently?

And in Five years will lansing have the same sort of buzz that is being generated in GR? I'm interested in what everyone thinks because I think that with Lansing being the state capitol and having a huge student population at it's doorstep, the potential should be exponential. It could become a mesh between what Ann Arbor is with it's student population and Grand Rapids is with it's authentic city feel.

I think that Lansing will definately have the kind of buzz GR is having 5 years from now. You hit the nail on the head when you said that given Lansing being the Capitol and with all the students that potential should be exponential, it's just a matter of capitalizing on it. I think that your right about Lansing having the ability to become the best of both worlds, with the nightlife of a college town and the feel of a bigger city. One thing that I've heard from people who have visited Lansing is that it is one of those "biggest little city" type deals, where the feel of the city is more like a city much larger than itself. One thing that I've heard of GR is just the opposite, "the littlest big city" where GR is a quite large metro, and even given it's size it still has the feel and attitude of a quint town, that has been changing though.

[tony speller]

I think that Lansing will definately have the kind of buzz GR is having 5 years from now. You hit the nail on the head when you said that given Lansing being the Capitol and with all the students that potential should be exponential, it's just a matter of capitalizing on it. I think that your right about Lansing having the ability to become the best of both worlds, with the nightlife of a college town and the feel of a bigger city. One thing that I've heard from people who have visited Lansing is that it is one of those "biggest little city" type deals, where the feel of the city is more like a city much larger than itself. One thing that I've heard of GR is just the opposite, "the littlest big city" where GR is a quite large metro, and even given it's size it still has the feel and attitude of a quint town, that has been changing though.

We'll see about that. Lansing's population is just over half of what GR's is, and the metro area less than half. with GR growing like crazy and Lansing not, it might take longer than 5 years. I'd like to see it come up though... Michigan needs other MAJOR cities besides Detroit.

As far as the University and keeping the students in Lansing is concerned, MSU's Medical School is moving to GR (link). If this works out, I don't know why MSU wouldn't look into relocating other programs/schools.

I would like to see Lansing catch up to Grand Rapids. Not beat it out though... of course.

[hood]

We'll see about that. Lansing's population is just over half of what GR's is, and the metro area less than half. with GR growing like crazy and Lansing not, it might take longer than 5 years. I'd like to see it come up though... Michigan needs other major cities besides Detroit.

As far as the University and keeping the students in Lansing is concerned, MSU's Medical School is moving to GR (link). If this works out, I don't know why MSU wouldn't look into relocating other programs/schools.

I would like to see Lansing catch up to Grand Rapids. Not beat it out though... of course.

GR's metro (redefined from the massive one that included Muskegon and Holland) is only about 750,000 compared to Lansing's, just shy of 550,000. GR is not growing like crazy, it's making moderate gains in population, nothing to get excited about. Lansing is making small gains, I think about 2/3's of GRs (from percentages). The only reason MSU is moving it's medical school is because of the unprecedented growth in healthcare in GR, still a large portion of the school is remaining in EL. Lansing could easily make some huge gains in the medical field and win the school back or at least stop any more moves. MSU has no reason to move any more schools, Lansing is actually ranked as a more educated metro than GR as a whole and MSU is beginning to implement its master plan which will invest huge amounts of money into its campus.

[tony speller]

the reason why Holland/Muskegon (and everywhere in between there and GR) are included in the metro is because there are a ton of people who live in that area and commute to GR for work/whatever. I'm no urban planner, but that's what I heard defines a Metropolitan Area. And actually, there isn't much country left between Hudsonville and Zeeland/Holland. maybe 10-15 min of driving at most. So it's not like the areas are totally disconnected. I'm sure when Lansing's metro area is taken into consideration, they count places like Jackson, etc.

Grand Rapids is growing pretty fast... population-wise and economically. I guess we'll see what happens a few years down the road. The merger of MSU and GVSU medical schools could be the beginning of something a bit more serious, bringing a lot more non-medical students to the area. Who knows.

I'm not trying to make this some sort of rivalry, I like Lansing a lot. Hopefully it will sprout into pretty major city within the next 10 years.

I know one thing though for sure... Whitecaps KILL Lugnuts

[RustTown]

Actually, your first post here was really trying to pit one against the other. IMO, Grand Rapids and Lansing have such separate dynamics that comparing one to the other is another apples-to-oranges, debate. If we're comparing Lansing to any city, it at least needs to be compared to comparable cities in feel and culture such as Madison (capitol with large university).

The whole GR vs. Lansing 'rivalry' is made up on here. I've never heard the two compared outside this forum as they are vastly different in almost every aspect. Being trapped between Grand Rapids and Detroit really hinders Lansing's marketability, IMO, and neither city sees this one as anything but the seat of state government. But, it's always been that way as Lansing was founded on a whim never meant to rival any of the other larger cities, but it didn't ultimately work out that way.

Lansing can REALLY make strides if it can rope in a significant number of the 30,000+ downtown state workers, and 25,000+ downtown students here on any given day. This is not even to mention that Lansing only needs to capture a tiny percent of MSU's 45,000 students to add to the other numbers. The potential is just amazing, but not any mayor has been able to capitalize off of it.

BTW, Hood, the former Danzo Hardware Building Lofts in REO Town look even better than they did a few weeks ago, and the building nextdoor to the south is now advertising 3 studio apartments. I'd really like to see the Michigan Electronics Building renovated, as I can only imagine how great the building looks under that blue painted wood facade.

[MJLO]

Tony my brother you are incorrect. You need to put Urban area to Urban area. Which is more accurately described by showing GR right around the 750k mark. I seriously, seriously hope, that there is not an air that there is a GR vs. Lansing rivalry. That would be a little bit more than silly. Lansing is setting itself up to really get to the next step. One thing Lansing has over GR is that while it suffered. It's downtown never went quite as low as GR's did, so It doesnt have as far to go.

But Lmich is right, Lansing and GR are apples and oranges. GR is bigger, but is not gaining that many people. Not nearly as many as in the previous decade. And one should note, that if it werent for the tremendous generosity of a handful of benefactors. Grand Rapids would not have been reversing it's trends at all. It's because a few people pumped billions of dollars into the city that others are taking note. As for the medical school, it's a tiny part of a massive university. Which is only happening because of the growing resources in Kent county. I'd be doubtful to see anything other than a satelite campus come from MSU. I'm sure they have agreements with Grand Valley State, not to grow in GR.

Be nice don't tease the Lansing forumers. They are much more tenacious than the ones in GR.

[seagull4]

Tony my brother you are incorrect. You need to put Urban area to Urban area. Which is more accurately described by showing GR right around the 750k mark. I seriously, seriously hope, that there is not an air that there is a GR vs. Lansing rivalry. That would be a little bit more than silly. Lansing is setting itself up to really get to the next step. One thing Lansing has over GR is that while it suffered. It's downtown never went quite as low as GR's did, so It doesnt have as far to go.

But Lmich is right, Lansing and GR are apples and oranges. GR is bigger, but is not gaining that many people. Not nearly as many as in the previous decade. And one should note, that if it werent for the tremendous generosity of a handful of benefactors. Grand Rapids would not have been reversing it's trends at all. It's because a few people pumped billions of dollars into the city that others are taking note. As for the medical school, it's a tiny part of a massive university. Which is only happening because of the growing resources in Kent county. I'd be doubtful to see anything other than a satelite campus come from MSU. I'm sure they have agreements with Grand Valley State, not to grow in GR.

Be nice don't tease the Lansing forumers. They are much more tenacious than the ones in GR.

I agree with your thoughts. The GR statistical area NO longer contains Holland or Muskegon. They stand on their own. It was rediculous they were ever part of the GR numbers in the first place. I read last week that Muskegon is experiencing the fastest growth rate in economy then any other metro area in the state. Holland was losing it's identity to Grand Rapids and yet is large enough to stand on it's own.

[hood]

My arguement when it comes to the metro area of GR, if they can include Muskegon, Holland and whatever the other county or two extra they had, Lansing should easily be able to claim Jackson, and maybe Howell. That would add about 300,000 people to our metro and many, many people travel from those areas and farther to work at GM, the State and MSU. One thing that may greatly help Lansing gain in the future would be if there was rapid mass transit between Lansing and Detroit, I'd bet there would be a considerable number of Detroit people who might want to live in Lansing and work in Detroit if there were a fast cheap way to get there. And yeah, the GR versus Lansing thing is something I want to avoid, I have gone out of the way here and other times to avoid that conflict when I'd love nothing more than to argue over it.

[MJLO]

Yeah, Making Grand Rapids Metro a six county region Inflated the numbers and made it look bigger than it was. My original point was not to pitt the forums against each other. It's like rubbing salt in wounds. GR Forumers shouldn't be arrogant. They have no reason to be. GR is on it's way, but is not quite there yet.

[hood]

I drove around town today and got a look at several projects. I went by Sparrow, they are finally working on the third floor, slow but sure they are moving on the building. Gaslight Village is working on it's second floor, although I was dissapointed to see how far the setback of the building is. They are almost half done with the brick facade on Stonehouse Village. They are also moving along nicely on The Beaumont, they are beginning on the apartment buildings and they have about one block on one side of the street of houses done. If the rain ever lets up I will try to get some pictures.

[asics]

I'm curious, approximately how far away is MSU campus from downtown Lansing?

[hood]

I'm not exactly sure, but maybe around 3 or 4 miles, maybe less.

[RustTown]

Yep, depending on which part of campus you're talking about it's 3.5-4 miles from the center of downtown Lansing.

[hood]

Just FYI, I counted up the number of units leased/pending lease at the Motor Wheel lofts today and there are now about 39 or about 33%. Thats with the earliest avaliblity in July, many units wont be avalible until August and September. The speed at which this building is leasing really suprises me, I hope that the leasing continues!

[RustTown]

I can't wait until retail follows all of this residential development. Central Lansing remains a retail graveyard. lol

[hood]

Retail is definately moving in the right direction, S Washington is doing pretty good, so is Michigan. What now must be worked on are the side streets within one to two blocks of S Washington, Grand, and the Cedar/Larch corridor. But overall I'm pretty happy with the way retail has progressed with the limited residential being added.

[RustTown]

I'm not. Having lived in central Lansing since we moved here, it remains largely unchanged retail-wise. There are still literally only a little bit over a handful of businesses open after five, and almost nothing is opened on the weekend save for the bars. Washington has a hard enough time maintaining, let alone growing. Hopefully, this new housing boom brings more and better businesses. I'm tired of having to go out to the edges of the city or suburbs for groceries and other necessities, and a lot of luxuries. I want to see a downtown electronics store, a small downtown grocery store...My pic of the litter, at the moment, is a dollar store only opened until right after five, a downtown convience store (the only thing besides the bar that really stays open after five), and a few restaurants. Washington has been stagnant for years simply holding on.

[downtownlansing77]

Washington has improved over the last five years ago. In 2000, it looked like crap and was filled with ugly vacant buildings. In just over 6 years, so much has changed. Not done yet by a long shot, but a lot better.

I'd also like to give a quick shout out to Clem's Collectibles. I'm not a comic book person, but they are open after 5 and have a lot of people going in and out of there. Their building owner is supposedly going to fix up the facade some time soon. The nice thing about Clem's is that it caters to both adults and kids, unlike much of the other retail establishments.

Has anyone heard what's going in the Hollister Building now that the cigar place moved across the street? Boji had said he was going to fix the building up, is he still planning to do so?

[RustTown]

The facade restorations have been a definite plus, no doubt, but the quality of the retail for a downtown area is still not up to par. Hopefully, and I really think it will, we'll start seeing business that will actually make the square fill more livable, because as it stands right now, it's still largely dead after five.

Development news has been really slow over the past few weeks.

[RustTown]

Not your typical construction news, but over the past week or two the riverfront of Moores Park has been upgraded. It was quite a surprise. They've finally pulled the River Trail all the way along the riverfront of the park, and they have fishing bridges/piers that jut out into the river. It's really impressive, and I was surprised as I hadn't taken the western leg of the River Trail in a few weeks. That's one park that gets used. It was so crowded yesterday.

[hood]

Has anyone heard what's going in the Hollister Building now that the cigar place moved across the street? Boji had said he was going to fix the building up, is he still planning to do so?

I think they are going to wait until the State's temporary lease runs out, and then the will begin the restoration, here is a thread for the building: Hollister Building

[hood]

They are almost done on the new wing at Ingham, unless the steel portion will also go up to four stories. They have been moving pretty quickly on this project all along, I hate the huge cement facade along Greenlawn though.

[RustTown]

That's just the support structure. It's going to be faced in brick/brick veneer.

[hood]

But the lack of windows is still pretty bad. From the renderings both sides will look quite nice though.