Economic Development

[Uncommon]

@spenser1058 why no mention of this? https://www.bizjournals.com/orlando/news/2021/07/12/dod-program-moves-to-orlando-opens-ai-contract-op.html

Or this? https://www.bizjournals.com/orlando/news/2021/07/12/fighter-pilot-training-firm-opens-orlando-tech-hub.html

Or any of the other articles that come out a couple of times a month that mention high wage earning opportunities being relocated to the area?

[spenser1058]

31 minutes ago, Uncommon said:

@spenser1058 why no mention of this? https://www.bizjournals.com/orlando/news/2021/07/12/dod-program-moves-to-orlando-opens-ai-contract-op.html

Or this? https://www.bizjournals.com/orlando/news/2021/07/12/fighter-pilot-training-firm-opens-orlando-tech-hub.html

Or any of the other articles that come out a couple of times a month that mention high wage earning opportunities being relocated to the area?

I often mention high tech additions to the area - they are exactly what we should be doing.

However, the first step to get out of a hole is to stop digging. And the theme park hole is infinitely larger than any ladder the tech additions provide right now.

We are 50 out of 50 when it comes to wages in the MSA. That’s because of the hospitality industry. Before we can concentrate on the higher-paying jobs we should be going after, we have to make sure we’re not going further in the hole by encouraging yet another park that will increase the low wages exponentially compared to the additions we get in high tech.

There was a time before Harry Potter reignited the local theme park arms race that most of the growth in the industry was switching to international locations. We had a real opportunity to balance the three-legged stool of the local economy. Then, everything exploded in the southwest quadrant again. Slowing that juggernaut down is now Job One or we’ll remain 50 of 50 as far out as you can imagine.

Unlike some, I’ve never wanted tourism to go away - today, we’re too dependent on it. We just need for it not to swallow everything else up any more than it already has.

Let me also add I’m not the only poster here and can’t do everything. Each of us can add important new additions like these as they come.

[orange87]

38 minutes ago, spenser1058 said:

I often mention high tech additions to the area - they are exactly what we should be doing.

However, the first step to get out of a hole is to stop digging. And the theme park hole is infinitely larger than any ladder the tech additions provide right now.

We are 50 out of 50 when it comes to wages in the MSA. That’s because of the hospitality industry. Before we can concentrate on the higher-paying jobs we should be going after, we have to make sure we’re not going further in the hole by encouraging yet another park that will increase the low wages exponentially compared to the additions we get in high tech.

There was a time before Harry Potter reignited the local theme park arms race that most of the growth in the industry was switching to international locations. We had a real opportunity to balance the three-legged stool of the local economy. Then, everything exploded in the southwest quadrant again. Slowing that juggernaut down is now Job One or we’ll remain 50 of 50 as far out as you can imagine.

Unlike some, I’ve never wanted tourism to go away - today, we’re too dependent on it. We just need for it not to swallow everything else up any more than it already has.

Let me also add I’m not the only poster here and can’t do everything. Each of us can add important new additions like these as they come.

The Florida minimum wage will take a huge jump in two months from $8.65/hr to $10/hr. It'll go up to $15/hr by 2026 and go up every year after that. Florida was surprisingly ahead of the curve on minimum wage.  This should help Orlando in those rankings I'd imagine.

[spenser1058]

58 minutes ago, orange87 said:

The Florida minimum wage will take a huge jump in two months from $8.65/hr to $10/hr. It'll go up to $15/hr by 2026 and go up every year after that. Florida was surprisingly ahead of the curve on minimum wage.  This should help Orlando in those rankings I'd imagine.

The problem is that rent is also going through the roof. When WDW first opened, the pay scale wasn’t great but housing was relatively affordable. That’s increasingly not the case. 

The $15 minimum wage is a good first step, but there’s so much more that needs to follow. The Tallahassee idiots continuing to refuse to accept Obamacare dollars for Medicaid (only one of 12 left that don’t), improved transit (instead we’re building toll roads minimum wage workers can’t afford), solid daycare and pre-K options for kids are in short supply for the folks who need them the most. 

Let’s also note the Tallahassee idiots are actively trying to screw up the enabling legislation for the minimum wage, just as they’ve done with medical marijuana, minimum class size requirements and too many others to count.

 

[jack]

16 minutes ago, spenser1058 said:

 Let’s also note the Tallahassee idiots are actively trying to screw up the enabling legislation for the minimum wage, just as they’ve done with medical marijuana, minimum class size requirements and too many others to count.

 

Another reason to address qualified immunity and blanket immunity for public employees. 

[Uncommon]

1 hour ago, orange87 said:

The Florida minimum wage will take a huge jump in two months from $8.65/hr to $10/hr. It'll go up to $15/hr by 2026 and go up every year after that. Florida was surprisingly ahead of the curve on minimum wage.  This should help Orlando in those rankings I'd imagine.

Not to mention some of Orlando’s largest employers will pay $15 an hour (Disney in October; Universal Studios started this 2 weeks ago). Orlando will still probably be 50th next year, but undoubtedly we’re moving in the right direction.

[spenser1058]

12 minutes ago, Uncommon said:

Not to mention some of Orlando’s largest employers will pay $15 an hour (Disney in October; Universal Studios started this 2 weeks ago). Orlando will still probably be 50th next year, but undoubtedly we’re moving in the right direction.

 

45 minutes ago, jack said:

Another reason to address qualified immunity and blanket immunity for public employees. 

Given that those problems were caused by legislators, I lost your point.

Meanwhile, the definition of madness is doing things the same way over and over again and expecting a different result.

Orlando had once broken free of that path (unlike, say, Daytona Beach) but now we’re doubling down on it. 

[jack]

13 hours ago, spenser1058 said:

 

Given that those problems were caused by legislators, I lost your point.

Meanwhile, the definition of madness is doing things the same way over and over again and expecting a different result.

Orlando had once broken free of that path (unlike, say, Daytona Beach) but now we’re doubling down on it. 

Elected officials are public employees and generally have immunity from lawsuits. What you described are clear attempts to overturn constitutionally approved amendments. If they actually think they could be sued for knowingly violating our rights, they will think twice. 

QE is not just about cops, it is about anyone that hold a public position. 

[dcluley98]

Disney could get more than $500 million in state tax breaks for new Lake Nona regional hub

"Disney’s capital investment for the project could be as much as $864 million, according to company projections made in documents released to the Orlando Sentinel on Wednesday from the state’s Department of Economic Opportunity.

An estimate shows Disney could claim more than $570 million in tax breaks over 20 years for the project, the documents say."

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/business/os-bz-prem-disney-capital-tax-incentive-20210721-64knssmg2zfsvjqcefcleynszi-story.html

That's $14,250 per job per year. . . LOL.  Disney sure knows how to work the system!

 

 

[aent]

On 7/21/2021 at 3:35 PM, dcluley98 said:

Disney could get more than $500 million in state tax breaks for new Lake Nona regional hub

"Disney’s capital investment for the project could be as much as $864 million, according to company projections made in documents released to the Orlando Sentinel on Wednesday from the state’s Department of Economic Opportunity.

An estimate shows Disney could claim more than $570 million in tax breaks over 20 years for the project, the documents say."

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/business/os-bz-prem-disney-capital-tax-incentive-20210721-64knssmg2zfsvjqcefcleynszi-story.html

That's $14,250 per job per year. . . LOL.  Disney sure knows how to work the system!

 

 

The state of Florida does offer this tax credit to everyone investing hundreds of millions in a facility... The idea is its going to generate jobs for people who will pay taxes, along with your tax liability is going to go up as a result of increased property taxes as well, so the state will still win. You can claim tax credit of up to 5% a year for capital investments over $100 million for 20-30 years, until the cost of your investment is recouped in the said tax credits. The average salary of these jobs that are getting relocated are over $120k per year, in addition to creating more taxable money for Disney, so the state is still gonna win.

[AmIReal]

On 7/24/2021 at 8:54 PM, aent said:

The state of Florida does offer this tax credit to everyone investing hundreds of millions in a facility... The idea is its going to generate jobs for people who will pay taxes, along with your tax liability is going to go up as a result of increased property taxes as well, so the state will still win. You can claim tax credit of up to 5% a year for capital investments over $100 million for 20-30 years, until the cost of your investment is recouped in the said tax credits. The average salary of these jobs that are getting relocated are over $120k per year, in addition to creating more taxable money for Disney, so the state is still gonna win.

I agree. While it seems silly to give $ to companies, the long tail increased tax base along with the short term construction costs is well worth it.

[spenser1058]

One of the biggest bits of misunderstanding I run into (and the real estate industrial complex locally is happy to perpetuate ) is that local governments don’t have the right to control how their cities are zoned and the ability to determine the aesthetics. Certainly, we’re told,  they cannot do such a thing in the South. What do you think this is, Portlandia? *egad*!?!

We’re also told if a city wants to grow it dare not even try to do those things or the results will be catastrophic.

Perhaps it’s instructive, then, to look at Savannah, GA. It’s pretty difficult to find a city more Southern than Savannah.

It has worked diligently since at least the 1950’s to keep the very special sense of history and pride of place in its downtown, maintaining the plans first developed by founder James Oglethorpe in the 18th century.

Surely the cost of doing that is not to grow, right?

Ummmm, no. Savannah’s MSA in fact grew 16.5% between 2010 and 2020, one of the faster growth rates in the country.

It also now has the third largest container port in the country (behind only LA and NYC/NJ). In fact, the port is on the cusp of a major expansion once the supply chain issues from COVID are unsnarled. That, along with growth in manufacturing, suggests Savannah will continue to grow and prosper in the next decade.

Keep that in mind the next time some developer tells you that citizens can’t build the city they want instead of the one some out of towner wants to foist upon us so he can line his pockets and then leave town.

Oh, and did I mention Savannah also has a thriving tourism business so apparently there’s no need to let those folks lead you around by the nose, either. It seems you CAN diversify your economy and move beyond the minimum wage jobs the hospitality industry is infamous for. Who knew!?!

Edited October 10, 2021 by spenser1058

[jack]

22 hours ago, spenser1058 said:

One of the biggest bits of misunderstanding I run into (and the real estate industrial complex locally is happy to perpetuate ) is that local governments don’t have the right to control how their cities are zoned and the ability to determine the aesthetics. Certainly, we’re told,  they cannot do such a thing in the South. What do you think this is, Portlandia? *egad*!?!

 

Aesthetics, yes. Zoning, no. Cities have the strong ability for controlling zoning. Savannah like other older cities have additional steps to control the look. Orlando has historic districts and overlays like Baldwin park that control the look of buildings. 

[spenser1058]

Zillow, facing big losses, will stop flipping houses and lay off 25% of its staff:

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/11/02/business/zillow-q3-earnings-home-flipping-ibuying.html?referringSource=articleShare

From The New York Times 
 

[orange87]

I was looking at the 2021 Fortune 500 list, and Florida has 20 on the list.

69 - Publix Super Markets (Lakeland)

104 - Jabil (St. Petersburg)

129 - Lennar (Fontainebleau)

145 - AutoNation (Fort Lauderdale)

147 - World Fuel Services (Doral)

163 - L3Harris Technologies (Melbourne)

166 - NextEra Energy (Juno Beach)

171 - Carrier Global (Palm Beach Gardens)

241 - Fidelity National Information Services (Jacksonville)

288 - Fidelity National Financial (Jacksonville)

292 - CSX (Jacksonville)

312 - ODP (Boca Raton)

346 - Mosaic (Tampa)

357 - Ryder System (Miami)

367 - Raymond James Financial (St. Petersburg)

377 - Darden Restaurants (Orlando)

403 - Chewy (Dania Beach)

441 - MasTec (Coral Gables)

453 - Icahn Enterprises (Sunny Isles Beach)

488 - Roper Technologies (Sarasota)

[spenser1058]

Universal’s CEO does not expect continued inflation and higher gas prices to affect attendance at its Florida parks. He also observed demand is currently outstripping capacity, which bodes well for Epic:

https://floridapolitics.com/archives/532418-universal-theme-park-demand-is-exceeding-capacity-despite-inflation-executive-says/

From Florida Politics 
 

Edited June 14, 2022 by spenser1058

[orange87]

I was looking at the 2024 Fortune 500 list, and Florida has 23 on the list.

70 - World Fuel Services (Miami)

78 - Publix Super Markets (Lakeland)

119 - Lennar (Miami)

121 - Jabil (St. Petersburg)

151 - AutoNation (Fort Lauderdale)

187 - NextEra Energy (Juno Beach)

196 - Carrier Global (Palm Beach Gardens)

217 - Mosaic (Tampa)

246 - L3Harris Technologies (Melbourne)

279 - CSX (Jacksonville)

283 - Fidelity National Information Services (Jacksonville)

294 - Icahn Enterprises (Sunny Isles Beach)

317 - Crown Holdings (Tampa)

345 - Ryder System (Miami)

359 - Fidelity National Financial (Jacksonville)

363 - Raymond James Financial (St. Petersburg)

389 - Chewy (Plantation)

394 - MasTec (Coral Gables)

402 - Darden Restaurants (Orlando)

435 - Hertz Global Holdings (Estero)

446 - ODP (Boca Raton)

489 - Landstar System (Jacksonville)

495 - Watsco (Miami)

[orange87]

Travel + Leisure eyes this downtown Orlando neighborhood for its HQ

The move would bring Travel + Leisure's headquarters into Parramore neighborhood from its current home near SeaWorld.

Article: https://www.bizjournals.com/orlando/news/2024/04/23/travel-leisure-downtown-incentives-parramore.html?utm_source=st&utm_medium=en&utm_campaign=BN&utm_content=OR&ana=e_OR_BN&j=35136144&senddate=2024-04-23

Edited Wednesday at 04:40 PM by orange87

[jrs2]

1 hour ago, orange87 said:

Travel + Leisure eyes this downtown Orlando neighborhood for its HQ

The move would bring Travel + Leisure's headquarters into Parramore neighborhood from its current home near SeaWorld.

Article: https://www.bizjournals.com/orlando/news/2024/04/23/travel-leisure-downtown-incentives-parramore.html?utm_source=st&utm_medium=en&utm_campaign=BN&utm_content=OR&ana=e_OR_BN&j=35136144&senddate=2024-04-23

Cannibalism, like with EA.  did they say if they would be moving into a build to suit new building for Parramore?

Note:  why is parramore underlined in red?  isn't that how its spelled?

[orange87]

3 hours ago, jrs2 said:

Cannibalism, like with EA.  did they say if they would be moving into a build to suit new building for Parramore?

Note:  why is parramore underlined in red?  isn't that how its spelled?

I'd love for them to build their new HQ on one of those three huge abandoned lots to the SW of the Kia Center.

Edited Wednesday at 09:55 PM by orange87

[jrs2]

3 hours ago, orange87 said:

I'd love for them to build their new HQ on one of those three huge abandoned lots to the SW of the Kia Center.

didn't there used to be apartments close to where that chilled water substation is on the right block?  this looks like it could be a potential location for a large park...for those three blocks.