Cameron Village Developments

[prodg52]

Does anyone know if they're planning on burying the power lines in front of the new developments at Clark and Oberlin? It looks bad with them there.

[DPK]

Does anyone know if they're planning on burying the power lines in front of the new developments at Clark and Oberlin? It looks bad with them there.

 

Yeah I believe the city will end up doing it North of Clark as per the streetscape plan:

http://www.raleighnc.gov/content/PWksTranServices/Documents/OberlinRoadStreetscape/OberlinRoadDraft_07022014.pdf

 

From Clark Avenue to the roundabout at 

Groveland Avenue and Pullen Road, overhead 

electrical lines will remain overhead, while lines 

crossing the street and communication lines 

will be buried. This alternative will improve the 

function and aesthetics of the streetscape at 

a lower level of investment. The transmission 

line over Clark Avenue is not proposed to be 

modified.

 

Both north and south of Clark Avenue, the city 

will undertake similar levels of investment. At this 

planning phase of the Oberlin Road Streetscape 

Project it is difficult to precisely estimate the 

costs this work. A rough estimate of the city’s 

cost is $100 per linear foot, leading to a total of 

$226,000 (2260’).

[Jones_]

Sorry I'm not sure if there is a pure Cameron Village thread so I was going to treat this one as that for now….just noting an observation coming down Oberlin from Wade, I saw that third apartment complex north of Teeter is having its site cleared of those simple office/retail buildings that were there. Sitting right there adjacent to that site I could see all the way down Oberlin to the Aloft on Hillsborough and wow its quite an incredible change the whole Oberlin and Hillsborough St area has gone through and is under going. I mean…I've lived downtown since 1992 and there's been a ton of change, but I've never seen an area go though such wholesale change all at once. There is another glass office building going in too immediately south of that old timey  sandwich shop (not sure the name). As expected I am not happy with the loss of another original Oberlin Village home but this office building looks like it'll be nice and sort of complete the modern urban form from Clark to Wade…meaning no big stretch of dead spots…I realize there are several lots not redeveloped. Anyway it sort of feels like history being made in a way...

[orulz]

That third complex I guess would be 616 Oberlin. And of course there's the 30-unit, 3-story project proposed at 818 Oberlin as well. So yeah, Oberlin is really having a massive transformation right now, but it was pretty predictable. Cameron Village seems to be kind of the best address in town from the perspective of amenities, location, and overall neighborhood aesthetics.

[Green_man]

And of course there's the 30-unit, 3-story project proposed at 818 Oberlin as well.

 

Whoa. Whoa. Whoa.  Has there been an actual project announced, or are you just referring to the rezoning application?  What are they doing with the old house there?!

[orulz]

I believe there is an actual project with a developer behind it in the works at 818, even if site plans have not been submitted to the city yet. From the rezoning application, the project does not include that little victorian bungalow at 814 Oberlin. That house is historically significant and is owned by the City of Raleigh.

[Jones_]

Whew. The three houses on the east side of Oberlin and the best ones left from Oberlin Village. 

[Green_man]

I was just looking through the Cameron Village and Hillsborough Street Small Area Plans on the City's website.  Somewhat interesting observation from the 2-2-2015 Issues & Opportunities Report:  in addition to the 14 zoning and site plan cases that have at least been mentioned on Urbanplanet, I saw two that were new (at least to me).

 

Under the category of "Property under development consideration":  the Rite-Aid in Cameron Village is highlighted as "2000 Cameron St", and the YWCA on Oberlin is highlighted as "1012 Oberlin Rd".

[orulz]

http://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/blog/real-estate/2016/01/cameron-village-drug-store-rite-aid-regency-center.html

York Properties was looking to tear down the Rite Aid pharmacy at Cameron Village and build multifamily residential. Rite aid, not wanting to close or relocate during construction,  would have none of it, and basically paid York off to get them to cancel the redevelopment, and grant them a 20 year lease (with 10 year extension) in their current location.

Instead the existing building will be reclad and reconfigured to move Rite Aid to the lower level and allow a new tenant on the upper level.

 

[RALNATIVE]

That area really does need a multi level parking garage. Parking at Cameron Village is a nightmare and I can't imagine developers adding more retail without taking into account the demands for additional parking.

[Jones_]

I wonder why they couldn't just move Rite Aid downstairs as they are doing, and then reinforce the building into a pedestal to support the Raleigh standard 5 stories of stick construction over that? And what the area needs is more people walking to it instead of forcing in their white Tahoes, Suburbans, Expeditions, Yukons...etc...(seriously, why are so many of them white?)....wouldn't apartments have provided built in walking customers? But surely other things are cooking over there and I'll be interested to see what they are....

[orulz]

There's a new item up in site review - a 24 condos on 2.17 acres at 904 Oberlin. 2-3 stories. This is a bit of an unusual one, half of the units are 4+ bedroom and it has 79 parking spaces. That bedroom count might make sense as student apartments but to me is a bit of a head scratcher as condos.

[Jones_]

This developer must have missed the memo that the four-rents-or-one-kitchen, classic student ghetto setup was relegated to Gorman and Avent Ferry a twenty years ago. I wouldn't think many 'investors' would be lining up to own these things nowadays. Definitely a change up from the recent direction everything between campus and Cameron Village has been going....high dollar single occupancy units, whether they be new houses or 'luxury' apartments....

[Green_man]

Maybe its more similar to the 3 new 5-unit condo buildings built at Five Points?  I think those are 3, or 4, or 5 bedroom units.  And sold well in the almost million dollar price range.  I wouldn't be too surprised someone is trying this near Cameron Village too.

Edited February 9, 2016 by Green_man

[paytonc]

As Green_man notes, the market for the 4BR condos with elevators and underground parking is probably empty-nesters, not students. The rezoning could have requested more units, but instead voluntarily capped the unit density.

As for Jones_' suggestion for Rite Aid, I highly doubt that in 1960 Colonial Stores built a foundation engineered to support additional floors. About the only times I've seen that happen were when a building's use changed to one with a significantly lighter load, e.g., cold-storage warehouses are designed to be crammed full of ice, so when they're converted to offices or residences they can sometimes support more floors.

Edited May 3, 2016 by paytonc

[Jones_]

Just to clarify, I'm basing my thought on the 4br part on the hundreds of such units around campus, and the presence of about zero such units for seniors...the three buildings going up by the post office in Five Points might have some 4 br units, but certainly not the whole buildings. My money is still on student housing, albeit higher end student housing.

Sure in 1960 they weren't thinking about additional floors. That is the nature of Cameron Village's original vision...to spread out. So while I'm not a structural PE it seems like it could be done....pull out the as-builts and/or original design and see what was put in. The west wall is almost certainly anchored into the embankment so one side is all set. Take some test bores too and see where the bedrock is...this site cascades off a plateau so it might be fairly shallow...I bet you could get away with screw piles at less than all four corners before going up. And I'm only talking about putting an envelope around the ground floor anyway to support some sticks over top....unconventional in this town, sure, but not unheard of, especially when historical resources are in play. 

 

[DPK]

Anyone happen to have TBJ access to this article?

http://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2017/05/19/biz-cameron-village-looking-to-go-underground.html

[Tenkai]

On 5/19/2017 at 4:45 PM, DPK said:

Anyone happen to have TBJ access to this article?

http://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2017/05/19/biz-cameron-village-looking-to-go-underground.html

Short story even shorter, they "have a plan" for bringing back the Village Subway's club scene.  The Fresh Market isn't going to use the space and they think that, given the success of the charity event they did there a few years ago, they can fill the space with the right kind of venues.

Edited May 22, 2017 by Tenkai

[Green_man]

Anyone have access to this article?  https://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2018/02/13/for-sale-prime-cameron-village-property-eyed-for.html

Looks like it's referring to this plot...

[DPK]

31 minutes ago, Green_man said:

Anyone have access to this article?  https://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2018/02/13/for-sale-prime-cameron-village-property-eyed-for.html

Sure, here ya go:

Quote

For sale?  Prime Cameron Village property eyed for development
By Ben Graham  –  Staff Writer, Triangle Business Journal
Feb 13, 2018, 8:20am EST Updated Feb 13, 2018, 2:29pm

A wedge of land located in a valuable spot directly next to Raleigh’s Cameron Village could soon be open for development – only if its 51 owners could agree to sell.

If that happens, the 4.9-acre property, located at the corner of Bellwood Drive and Cameron Street, could be home to hundreds of apartment units and new ground-floor retail.

That is what many of the live-in owners and landlords at the Bellwood condominium community would like to see. For them, the mounting costs of maintaining the 1940s-era units have become a burden and are reason enough to sell.

A recent lawsuit from one of the homeowners over a water leak in one of the aging units resulted in the HOA having to undertake $150,000 in structural repairs, according to a letter the HOA board sent to owners last year.

An engineering study commissioned after the incident revealed another $675,000 in extensive repairs needed in the near-term throughout the entire property, including roof replacements for most buildings, repairs to damaged wood trim and structural fixes to crawl spaces, the letter states. All told, the bill would be $12,273 per unit, and insurance increases would be likely.

The backlog of maintenance and structural problems with the units have already led to a spike in HOA dues. HOA president Sara Walker says hers are now $550, up from $180 when she bought the property in 2013.

For these reasons, and given the location and value of the development, the HOA board has enlisted the help of a real estate agent to market the property. CBRE Raleigh Senior Vice President Chester Allen is working with the HOA and is accepting offers until March 8. After that, the bids will be presented to the condo owners. “I think it’s exciting,” Walker says. “It’s rife for development. In my mind, Bellwood could be more than what it is now.”

The only potential hang up is that all of the owners need to agree to sell, and there are a few who aren’t totally on board yet. Dana Phelps Hughens, a public relations professional with Clairemont Communications, lives in one of the units with her son, who attends neighboring Broughton High School. She has pumped money into the unit every year and is hesitant to part ways with it. “It’s so charming and so quaint,” Hughens says. “It just seems like a Raleigh gem to me. I don’t think we should be quick to say, ‘hey, let’s just bulldoze this and build up to five stories like everyone else around us just because we can.’”

She also notes that she likely wouldn’t be able to find another place anywhere nearby at a similar price point. For some people, the condos represent perhaps their only toehold to remaining homeowners inside of Raleigh’s beltline. An initial rough assessment from real estate agents estimated the property could fetch between $14 million and $18 million, according to letter last year, which breaks down to $250,000 to $330,000 per unit. The units are currently valued at $172,000 each, according to Wake County records.

Last week, Raleigh City Council approved changes to a plan that will shape growth around Cameron Village, allowing the Bellwood property’s zoning to go up from three stories to five. A marketing package released for the property includes a potential site layout that has two six-story, mixed-use buildings totaling 340 units, ground-floor retail and a parking deck. Included in the package is a statistic that says the average home price within three miles is $714,000.

 

[DPK]

38 minutes ago, Green_man said:

Looks like it's referring to this plot...

 

I believe you're right and upon reading the article it looks like all 51 unit owners would have to agree to the sale.  That's definitely going to be interesting as there is always that one hold out that digs in their heels.  I can understand why they wouldn't want to sell however.  That's a prime location and if you are older, where are you going to go?  If you get on the lower end $250k from the sale, there isn't really a swath of residential nearby you can buy into.  I guess it depends on just how much a developer wants it -- they could give all unit owners #extra on top of the assessed value so that these people have a shot at still moving to another home in the area, but I doubt that.

With that said, if you're voting to sell your home and then are unhappy that you can't afford to live in the area after -- beggars can't be choosers.

[JeffC]

This article illustrates why so many apartments are being built now and so few condos...When time comes to redevelop, condos are a nightmare, because economics (and human  psychology) dictates that there is always one holdout...How long did that one kooky guy hold on at the Velvet Cloak before they finally got him to leave??

[nicholas]

I guess this is the right thread for this.  These don't look too bad, certainly not as pathetic as other developments that have been proposed (you know who you are,  Logan and Chamberlain...)

[DPK]

On 11/17/2018 at 9:39 PM, nicholas said:

I guess this is the right thread for this.  These don't look too bad, certainly not as pathetic as other developments that have been proposed (you know who you are,  Logan and Chamberlain...)

 

Those are kind of cute.  Looks like "mostly" brick on the outside.

[Jones_]

I'm curious to see if the cream colored brick is a seller or not. The prices are over a million according to an article but they don't seem to list them on their website. They shield them from the listing sites too, so they must want to meet you and size up your exclusive characteristics before discussing price. Can't have rabble bad mouthing them online using things like specifics. 

Edited November 19, 2018 by Jones_