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Housing Prices

Jenkins

By Jenkins
in Providence

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Airwaves Unincorporated Area

Airwaves

Posted
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"One other thing, the good developers are not averse to doing what it takes to get a good, profitable project. If zoning has a maximum height of 200 feet, but by including 10 affordable units, you can get 25 more market units and a max height of 300 feet, the developer is going to do it. These are not disincentives here, merely tradeoffs."

Absolutely true.

I still stand firm that IZ zones are mostly voluntary. None of the cities you mentined have them city-wide - only in specific sections. But agreed - enough with affordable housing! Coutuit - you bring up a good point. Just how will the elite inhabitants of these sexy new buildings deal with the disaster in Kennedy Plaza?

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Cotuit Megalopolis

Cotuit

Posted
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Saw this in another section and wanted everyones opinion. It went nowhere before though ... maybe I should take the hint ;)

I really shouldn't let you post this in it's entirety, do you happen to know where it came from so I can edit it into a link?

Where will most of the development go? Up: Urban infill will outstrip suburban growth...

Encouraging

...NEW GROWTH INDUSTRY: New York City and Boston will be hotbeds of quantum computing and encryption...

We can read "Boston" to include Providence, since by 2030 we will certain be part of Boston's metro, but we can't just sit back and wait for it to happen.

...BEST COMMERCIAL REAL ESTATE BET: Ripping down old big-box malls and converting them into denser developments with offices, shops, and condos...

Hell yeah! North Main Street, hello? We're tearing you down! :)

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Cotuit Megalopolis

Cotuit

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http://www.urbanplanet.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=17832

sorry there ya go

its urbanplanet>>urban new>>$25 trillion dollar land grab

Ah, I think that thread was posted before we tightened the rules on article posting. Here's what it has to say about the Atlantic Seaboard.

ATLANTIC SEABOARD

The country

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Garris Town

Garris

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Upstate NY is a screaming bargain... Buffalo is a lot like Providence, but bigger. A beautiful, old city full of great architecture that is just waiting for people and businesses to occupy it, and it couldn't be any cheaper. Their troubles are even more bitter because Buffalo was promised it would become a flourishing trade city because of its proximity to Toronto after NAFTA was passed, and it just hasn't happened.

Amazing that Pittsburgh is also so affordable considering how desirable a city it is as well.

- Garris

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DrStink Unincorporated Area

DrStink

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Why should the city subsidize this? Why should 10 people win some lottery to live better than their peers? And what guarantees that the 10 people aren't people who win special favors with the selection committee? Give me some really good reasons outside of some utopian view that everyone will be happier if we can just get them to mix more.

Maybe because what evidence there is, albeit limited, suggests it actually does make a difference, if you are patient enough to wait around to see the positive results. Consider what David Brooks wrote in his op-ed about Katrina:

That's why the second rule of rebuilding should be: Culturally Integrate. Culturally Integrate. Culturally Integrate. The only chance we have to break the cycle of poverty is to integrate people who lack middle-class skills into neighborhoods with people who possess these skills and who insist on certain standards of behavior.

The most famous example of cultural integration is the Gautreaux program, in which poor families from Chicago were given the chance to move into suburban middle-class areas. The adults in these families did only slightly better than the adults left behind, but the children in the relocated families did much better.

These kids suddenly found themselves surrounded by peers who expected to graduate from high school and go to college. After the shock of adapting to the more demanding suburban schools, they were more likely to go to college, too.

The Clinton administration built on Gautreaux by creating the Moving to Opportunity program, dispersing poor families to middle-class neighborhoods in five other metropolitan areas. This time the results weren't as striking, but were still generally positive. The relocated parents weren't more likely to have jobs or increase their earnings (being close to job opportunities is not enough -- you need the skills and habits to get the jobs and do the work), but their children did better, especially the girls.

The lesson is that you can't expect miracles, but if you break up zones of concentrated poverty, you can see progress over time.

Here's what wikipedia has to say about the Gautreaux program - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hills_v._Gautreaux

And here is the webpage of the Northwestern sociologist that conducted all the research.

http://www.northwestern.edu/ipr/people/rosenbaum.html

So, in answer to your question, I think that's a pretty good reason beyond misguided utopian idealism.

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eltron Hamlet

eltron

Posted
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San Diego's Inclusionary Zoning Law Illegal, Court Says

This thread has been dormant for a while, but here is something that caught my eye. San Diego is seeking to change its IZ law just enough to avoid a lawsuit, but the BIA wants it scrapped altogether. Does this bode poorly for future conflicts if Providence passes IZ?

I don't know the specifics of the San Diego law, but if IZ were passed in Providence, it would have ample legal standing. The Rhode Island zoning enabling law allows IZ in local municipalities, and it has already been implemented in several towns in RI.

So, in answer to your question, I think that's a pretty good reason beyond misguided utopian idealism.

Great post...

very interesting reading.

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Jerry2 Hamlet

Jerry2

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I knew this day was coming. The landlord recently put the dreaded sign outside declaring the home for sale by owner. A few months back, they asked me for assistance on a refinance and I was shocked to see them on an exotic variable rate on an investment property. They were also maxed out of the value. (They don't have enough equity to even use a realtor)This is only a matter of time before this house is foreclosed on. Looks like I'll be moving soon....

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pete11 Whistle-Stop

pete11

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I knew this day was coming. The landlord recently put the dreaded sign outside declaring the home for sale by owner. A few months back, they asked me for assistance on a refinance and I was shocked to see them on an exotic variable rate on an investment property. They were also maxed out of the value. (They don't have enough equity to even use a realtor)This is only a matter of time before this house is foreclosed on. Looks like I'll be moving soon....

....and the band played on.

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Garris Town

Garris

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There's a good article on Providence to Boston commuting, condos in Rhode Island, etc. in this months Projo Homes monthly magazine, but I can't find it online. I think Ari's quoted in it.

Where can we find the print copies?

- Garris

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Divot Unincorporated Area

Divot

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Let's say you were in the market for a 1bd condo. The Westin condos ($459K) start about 14.75% above the entry level Waterplace condos ($400K) according to emails they sent me. The Westin is obviouslly nicer: you start on the 16th floor and go up from there as opposed to the 3rd floor in Waterplace, seems to have better materials and layouts... So my question is which would be a better investment going forward? And do you think either building will be forced to cut prices due to a soft housing market.

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provid Hamlet

provid

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One thing to consider is if you want to live in a hotel or not. Some people (including myself) find the idea of living in a hotel very unattractive. People who live in hotels tend to keep to themselves and have little involvement with the people/things around them. You also have hotel guest around you 24/7- Some people like this some people hate it.

I do not think you will ever see a price cut at the Westin - The Westin has the strongest draw for corporate condos than any of the new buildings downtown it will also be the first to come online. I would be very surprised if they ever lower the prices. Waterplace I could see a possible price drop or atleast more room to haggle with them. Its hard to say though because the condo market could be alot stroger or as is when the project is done.

Keep in mind if you are looking at Waterplace and the unit you like is facing the statehouse because they have permits to construct a future 10 and 12 story building(s) on the same lot.

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