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IN PROGRESS: The Dynamo House (Heritage Harbor)

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mental757 Burg

mental757

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- Garris

PS: For a city our size and with our skyline, I think Providence's night lighting is far from dull or bland. Quite the opposite! The Superman is almost glowing, you have the necklace on Hospital Trust, there's the Biltmore's sign, the Westin (and soon Westin II's) baroque gable lighting, and the Capitol. Union Station is lit, hopefully Waterplace and 110 will have a lighting scheme, GTech will have their sign and tower... In fact, I think the Textron Building (they never answered my e-mails!!) is the only one without lighting!

perhaps bland was too strong a word - I just wanted to point out that I think the lighted stacks will add a very unique, very impressionable lighting scheme to the current nightline - a more exiting element that is currently not there...

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gregw Hamlet

gregw

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I think the combination of the Dynamo House stacks, the three iconic Manchester St. ones, and the new 195 bridge plus the (hopefully signature) pedestrian bridge and the Point St. bridge will create an amazing cluster that will be like a second skyline. When the 195 land gets built on it may become seamlessly connected to the downcity skyline that extends north to the Statehouse.

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gregw Hamlet

gregw

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I know where I saw that factoid about the stacks being 300+ feet. When I went to the Russian Sub Museum, I walked around the little park there. They had a sign or plaque there talking about the historical significance of the power plant ...

The South Street station (aka Dynamo House) used to have a huge stack on top of the square building in the front of the complex which may have reached 300'. Artinruins has some historical photos that show it.

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Prov001 Crossroads

Prov001

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I am happy to hear that after years of stagnation the Baltimore Developer Streuver Bros, Eccles&Rouse has taken reign and proceeding with plans for the Heritage Harbor Museum/Dynamo House.

However, I am not happy with the proposed massive scale-back of the size of the museum. Depending on what article you read, the museum was to be between 180,000 to 260,000 square feet. The new proposal is for 55,000 square feet. Even if you were to go by the 180,000 square feet plan this is a huge downsize in the project.

I have no issue with the developers turning it into a mixed-use property, ie hotel, restaurant and office space, however the 130,000 square feet allocated for office space is not appropriate.

The original plans for Heritage Harbor called for 25 themed exhibits including a triple-decker house with live actors, Corliss steam engine in a "Time Machine" electronic exhibit theater, a life-sized replica of a 15th century portuguese caraval,the American Diner Museum, areas such as the jewelry industry, military history, natural history and steamships. In addition, there was to be a food court, a carousel, museum store, children's play area, education center, outdoor festival park and theater, the nation's first high-definition history theater, a library and research center, offices for the Rhode Island Historical Society and Rhode Island Hall of Fame and the Smithsonian Institution alone was to have a 13,500 square foot area devoted to special rotating exhibits. All this and much more.

This museum has been touted as one of the premier or must-see destinations in Rhode Island and one of the top 20 visitor attractions in New England so why not give it the space it deserves?

With all the development Providence has seen this was actually one of the best projects to come along in years.

Office buidings are fine as they employ people and bring needed tax revenue to the city but at the end of the day they are what they are: office buidings...people go there to work and then go home... and they don't necessarily add to the excitement, uniqueness or vibrancy to the city and do absolutely nothing culturally for it unless you consider sticking a restaurant in the bottom of it cultural. As for all the condos and apartments either being built or converted from other buildings , what about all the new people living there? People like and want things to see and do.

What about the tourists? One of Providence's biggest industries is tourism. Tourist are not likely to come to Providence to see office buildings and condominium towers. They, like the people who live here want things to see and do.

Despite hundreds of millions of dollars being pumped into the city Providence has not produced any major destinations(with the exception of Providence Place), landmarks or cultural or artistic institutions.

The new RISD Chace Center will be an exciting addition to Providence but not unique. Most cities, even a lot of the smaller ones, have art museums to varying degrees. Having been to the Providence Children's Museum with my nephew it is neither one of the better Children's Museum and once again, not unique in its concept. The rehabilitation of the Veterans Memorial Auditorium and the Masonic Hall is welcome news but most cities have a theater(s) and/or hotels. The makeover of the Holiday Inn(now Hilton)and the Dunkin'Donuts Center will bring a cleaner, crisper look to the city but does not offer a unique experience.

People, whether they be tourist or resident, want a unique experience.

In addition, most youngsters are most likely not going to want to spend the day or even a couple of hours in the Chace Center and if you don't have a child/grandchild/nephew/niece, adults are not going to go to the Children's Museum.

The Heritage Harbor offers that unique experience, to people of all ages and to residents and tourists alike. Reducing the scope of the museum to a mere 55,000 square feet is not a good thing. Hell, the new Walmart in Providence is going to be over 120,000 square feet.

All cities no matter how great they are need to reinvent themselves from time to time. Providence was given that opportunity with the redirection of its rivers, moving of train tracks and creation of Waterplace/Riverwalk. Priceless development opportunities were opened up on the water's edge in the heart of downtown. Opportunities for an aquarium, artistic or cultural institutions, a maritime village, museums and recreational opportunities...but instead was handed over to corporations for office towers and developers to build condo towers. While the office and condominium towers sure do make for a pretty skyline they have not truly enriched or added to the fabric of Providence...and while I believe that Waterfire is probably one of the most beautiful and unique experiences I have ever had, when it is not a scheduled evening or time of season for it the Riverwalk is essentially deserted day and night except for a few people. I have been to Providence Place Mall and it has been packed with people...but cross the street to the Riverwalk and no one is there. I have seen Union Station Brewery, Citron, Capital Grill and RiRa full of people, but once again, cross the street into the Waterpark and it is essentially empty. People need a reason to go there. I think the city relied to much on the assumption that the Riverwalk was a destination in itself. When the two condominium towers are complete the area is not going to suddenly come to life or be more exciting. People will go into their condos and do what they purchased them for...live. The one or two restuarants that may come to fruition from these projects will bring some additional people to the area but it is not going to be an entertainment mecca or offer any kind of unique experience. The Riverwalk is a beautiful addition to Providence but unless there is a concert or Waterfire scheduled it is what it is... a pleasant stroll. It is not educational, informative or entertaining.

Heritage Harbor was at least some glimmer of hope to correct all the missed opportunities.

I wish the Heritage Harbor/Dynamo House the best of luck and thank Streuver Bros. for investing in and proceeding with this project but it sure is sad to see what could have indeed been a true shining jewel for the city of Providence has now been reduced in scope and size.

Providence should not be settling for scaled down projects or think that something is better than nothing. Do it right the first time. It is not so easy to go back and add on, correct or redo.

I think Providence deserves better and I think Rhode Island's nearly 400 year history deserves better and to be told and displayed in its entirety.

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Lone Ranger Burg

Lone Ranger

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It is not educational, informative or entertaining.

No it isn't. And all of those things are nice, even necessary. But to play devil's advocate for a moment here, money is also nice & necessary to have, and Providence needs more of it.

That's quite the letter. I assume you sent a copy of this to Struever Bros?

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jencoleslaw Town

jencoleslaw

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I am happy to hear that after years of stagnation the Baltimore Developer Streuver Bros, Eccles&Rouse has taken reign and proceeding with plans for the Heritage Harbor Museum/Dynamo House.

However, I am not happy with the proposed massive scale-back of the size of the museum. Depending on what article you read, the museum was to be between 180,000 to 260,000 square feet. The new proposal is for 55,000 square feet. Even if you were to go by the 180,000 square feet plan this is a huge downsize in the project.

I have no issue with the developers turning it into a mixed-use property, ie hotel, restaurant and office space, however the 130,000 square feet allocated for office space is not appropriate.

The original plans for Heritage Harbor called for 25 themed exhibits including a triple-decker house with live actors, Corliss steam engine in a "Time Machine" electronic exhibit theater, a life-sized replica of a 15th century portuguese caraval,the American Diner Museum, areas such as the jewelry industry, military history, natural history and steamships.

In addition, there was to be a food court, a carousel, museum store, children's play area, education center, outdoor festival park and theater, the nation's first high-definition history theater, a library and research center, offices for the Rhode Island Historical Society and Rhode Island Hall of Fame and the Smithsonian Institution alone was to have a 13,500 square foot area devoted to special rotating exhibits. All this and much more.

This museum has been touted as one of the premier or must-see destinations in Rhode Island and one of the top 20 visitor attractions in New England so why not give it the space it deserves?

With all the development Providence has seen this was actually one of the best projects to come along in years.

Office buidings are fine as they employ people and bring needed tax revenue to the city but at the end of the day they are what they are: office buidings...people go there to work and then go home... and they don't necessarily add to the excitement, uniqueness or vibrancy to the city and do absolutely nothing culturally for it unless you consider sticking a restaurant in the bottom of it cultural. As for all the condos and apartments either being built or converted from other buildings , what about all the new people living there? People like and want things to see and do.

What about the tourists? One of Providence's biggest industries is tourism. Tourist are not likely to come to Providence to see office buildings and condominium towers. They, like the people who live here want things to see and do.

Despite hundreds of millions of dollars being pumped into the city Providence has not produced any major destinations(with the exception of Providence Place), landmarks or cultural or artistic institutions.

The new RISD Chace Center will be an exciting addition to Providence but not unique. Most cities, even a lot of the smaller ones, have art museums to varying degrees. Having been to the Providence Children's Museum with my nephew it is neither one of the better Children's Museum and once again, not unique in its concept. The rehabilitation of the Veterans Memorial Auditorium and the Masonic Hall is welcome news but most cities have a theater(s) and/or hotels. The makeover of the Holiday Inn(now Hilton)and the Dunkin'Donuts Center will bring a cleaner, crisper look to the city but does not offer a unique experience.

People, whether they be tourist or resident, want a unique experience.

In addition, most youngsters are most likely not going to want to spend the day or even a couple of hours in the Chace Center and if you don't have a child/grandchild/nephew/niece, adults are not going to go to the Children's Museum.

The Heritage Harbor offers that unique experience, to people of all ages and to residents and tourists alike. Reducing the scope of the museum to a mere 55,000 square feet is not a good thing. Hell, the new Walmart in Providence is going to be over 120,000 square feet.

All cities no matter how great they are need to reinvent themselves from time to time. Providence was given that opportunity with the redirection of its rivers, moving of train tracks and creation of Waterplace/Riverwalk. Priceless development opportunities were opened up on the water's edge in the heart of downtown. Opportunities for an aquarium, artistic or cultural institutions, a maritime village, museums and recreational opportunities...but instead was handed over to corporations for office towers and developers to build condo towers.

While the office and condominium towers sure do make for a pretty skyline they have not truly enriched or added to the fabric of Providence...and while I believe that Waterfire is probably one of the most beautiful and unique experiences I have ever had, when it is not a scheduled evening or time of season for it the Riverwalk is essentially deserted day and night except for a few people. I have been to Providence Place Mall and it has been packed with people...but cross the street to the Riverwalk and no one is there.

I have seen Union Station Brewery, Citron, Capital Grill and RiRa full of people, but once again, cross the street into the Waterpark and it is essentially empty. People need a reason to go there. I think the city relied to much on the assumption that the Riverwalk was a destination in itself. When the two condominium towers are complete the area is not going to suddenly come to life or be more exciting. People will go into their condos and do what they purchased them for...live. The one or two restuarants that may come to fruition from these projects will bring some additional people to the area but it is not going to be an entertainment mecca or offer any kind of unique experience.

The Riverwalk is a beautiful addition to Providence but unless there is a concert or Waterfire scheduled it is what it is... a pleasant stroll. It is not educational, informative or entertaining.

Heritage Harbor was at least some glimmer of hope to correct all the missed opportunities.

I wish the Heritage Harbor/Dynamo House the best of luck and thank Streuver Bros. for investing in and proceeding with this project but it sure is sad to see what could have indeed been a true shining jewel for the city of Providence has now been reduced in scope and size.

Providence should not be settling for scaled down projects or think that something is better than nothing. Do it right the first time. It is not so easy to go back and add on, correct or redo.

I think Providence deserves better and I think Rhode Island's nearly 400 year history deserves better and to be told and displayed in its entirety.

I had to make this readable.

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foxpointer Whistle-Stop

foxpointer

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Let's be clear about how this all came about: HHM has demonstrated over the past 10 years that it could not raise the necessary funds to construct and operate a large-scale history museum. It botched the statewide bond issue a few years back and its private fundraising never got on track. Most of the money it did raise was spent on its staff, which reached into the twenties at one point.

Such experiences lead the HHM itself to decide that the best -- perhaps only -- way it could open a history museum of ANY size would be to leverage its only asset: the property. The HHM issued an RFP for co-developers, of which SBER was one respondent. Because the Dynamo House will be a mixed use project, the HHM now has a fighting chance to open its doors and fulfill its educational mission.

Undersand that virtually all state history museums are heavily subsidized by public sources, most often state governments. If the state was unwilling to be the rainmaker for this project, and its residents rejected a bond issue to fund its construction, shouldn't we be somewhat grateful that we're getting anything at all? Mind you, 55,000 SF is not small by Rhode Island standards. This will be a substantial facility that will be the State's only link to the Smithsonian collections.

One final point: consider the scenario in which the state was the largest investor in the HHM. Where would the HHM go to fund capital cost overruns and/or operating losses resulting from increased construction costs or attendance not meeting projections? (Aside: a likely scenario, as the attendance projections for HHM were highly optimistic and history museums are not the attendance generators that aquariums and science museums are.) Is a heavily subsidized 200,000 SF project more attractive than a self-suporting 55,000 SF project, especially considering the current fiscal problems at the State House?

We should be supporting the HHM to ensure it becomes a premiere visitor destination in Providence, despite its size. Nothing wrong with a jewel box, especialy when it's full.

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Cotuit Megalopolis

Cotuit

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Office buidings are fine as they employ people and bring needed tax revenue to the city but at the end of the day they are what they are: office buidings...people go there to work and then go home... and they don't necessarily add to the excitement, uniqueness or vibrancy to the city and do absolutely nothing culturally for it unless you consider sticking a restaurant in the bottom of it cultural. As for all the condos and apartments either being built or converted from other buildings , what about all the new people living there? People like and want things to see and do.

What office buildings and condos and apartments add to the cultural vibrancy of the city is people. Providence, especially it's Downtown needs more people (and it certainly need more jobs). No, I won't be attending a play or concert in the Waterplace towers, but the people living there will be more customers to draw plays and concerts to the city that I may want to see.

Waterplace Park is a catch 22, people do not go to Waterplace when there's not a WaterFire because people do not go to Waterplace when there's not a WaterFire. The addition of GTECH and Ruth's Chris changes that, sure people eating al fresco at a steak house is not cultural, but if cultural event planners feel that those al fresco dinners could be enticed to stay in Waterplace after eating, then they may plan events. Same goes for the restaurant and retail that will occupy the Waterplace towers, for the first time there will be a reason for people to go to Waterplace, and it's up to the cultural institutions to give them a reason to stay.

Providence should not be settling for scaled down projects or think that something is better than nothing. Do it right the first time. It is not so easy to go back and add on, correct or redo.

I think that there is good opputunity to expand Heritage Harbor at a later date, there is a huge vacant lot north of the power station that could be used for museum expansion in the future.

I have to agree with Fox Pointer, I'd rather see a scaled back Heritage Harbor and the ancilliary development that is now slated for the Dynamo House than wait another decade while Heritage Harbor spins it's wheels on fundraising and the power station sits empty.

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Prov001 Crossroads

Prov001

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"That's quite the letter. I assume you sent a copy to Streuver Bros"?

Hi Lone...I have no intentions of forwarding the letter...more of a lamentation letter than anything else. Thanks for reading it.

"I had to make this readable".

Thanks Jen...I made my own eyes cross-eyed after reading what I wrote.

Foxpointer you make some very valid points. Very good insight.

As stated I have no issues with the project now being mixed-use, in fact, I think most mixed-use projects are more economically prudent.

I also don't have an issue with the museum being scaled down, it is only to the huge degree it has been scaled down.

That being said I do support HHM and am thankful(though not simply because I should be grateful because at least Providence is getting something...I have never subscibed to the something is better than nothing philosophy)as I wished HHM the best of luck and thanked Streuver Bros for investing in and proceeding with the project.

Let's hope you are right Foxpointer and this will indeed be the full jewel box that Providence is deserving of.

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xine Whistle-Stop

xine

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55,000 sf is still Gi-normous!

I don't think it will seem like a small museum or an afterthought...it also depends on the quality of the museum to make a lasting impression or be a draw for visitors.

For reference, if that size space were a restaurant dining room, it would seat over 3500 people. If it were a gallery, you could have a reception for more than 7500 people.

For a more reasonable comparison, the permanent exhibition spaces at the US Holocaust Museum off the Mall in DC - which is one of the biggest and best social history museums I can think of - are only 36,000 sf. And I have never heard anyone who's visited there complain that it didn't make an impression or was too small.

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rhuck Unincorporated Area

rhuck

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For a more reasonable comparison, the permanent exhibition spaces at the US Holocaust Museum off the Mall in DC - which is one of the biggest and best social history museums I can think of - are only 36,000 sf. And I have never heard anyone who's visited there complain that it didn't make an impression or was too small.

That is not a reasonable comparison because a Holocaust Museum would likely have only a few large structures in it. I've never been to the Holocaust Museum, but I would expect it to consist more of images and small artifacts than, say, a large ship or a boat. The Heritage Harbor Museum would (or should, anyway), require more space if they intend to exhibit ships and other huge structures inside.

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brick Burg

brick

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The Heritage Harbor Museum would (or should, anyway), require more space if they intend to exhibit ships and other huge structures inside.

The thing is that the ships in question could probably all be living museums. The location is right on the water and because of the hurricane barrier there is little threat that the land would be needed for a "real" marina like the water across the street from the Herreshof Museum.

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basachs Burg

basachs

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That is not a reasonable comparison because a Holocaust Museum would likely have only a few large structures in it. I've never been to the Holocaust Museum, but I would expect it to consist more of images and small artifacts than, say, a large ship or a boat. The Heritage Harbor Museum would (or should, anyway), require more space if they intend to exhibit ships and other huge structures inside.

The Holocaust museum has an actual train car used to transfer people to the camps in it. Plenty big. There is a collection of all the shoes taken from prisoners in mountains on either side of a gangplank as you walk through it. Again, plenty big. Yes there are lots of images and artifacts, but also lots of big permanent exhibitions.

xine is right. 55k of space is a big chunk of space.

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foxpointer Whistle-Stop

foxpointer

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My hope is that the exhibits are interactive and provide repeatable experiences. This not only would provide the best visitor experience, but will also help sustain the museum over time, as visitors will have something new to return to see. In fact, just changing the name (removing the word 'museum') and changing that horribly confusing logo (is it a maritime museum? is it a city museum?) would be a good start.

I have always found it hilarious that one of the 'centerpiece' exhibits is a typical three-decker tenament house. Do we really need a replica of 70% of Rhode Island's housing stock?

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Recchia Town

Recchia

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I have always found it hilarious that one of the 'centerpiece' exhibits is a typical three-decker tenament house. Do we really need a replica of 70% of Rhode Island's housing stock?

Yes, all the suburbanites will be mesmerized by getting to see a "ghetto house" up close without them feeling in danger :rolleyes:

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