2020 politics

[samsonh]

1 hour ago, Armacing said:

The ratios are not the same.   The standard of living has definitely gone down.  A family used to live comfortably on one income, now they struggle with two incomes.  The Fed has been consistently inflating the money supply over the past 60 years to prop up wall street asset values and create the mother-of-all credit bubbles and that has been financed by the savings of everyday Americans.  The Fed's target inflation rate is above the interest rate they set for bank deposits, so what does that tell you?  They don't want you to save... but who can save, really?  The cost of essentials like housing and medical care  (both of which suffer from artificial supply constraints imposed by the government) has risen much faster than the widely referenced "Consumer Price Index".  

This flies in the face of real world data and lived experiences.  Our standard of living has most certainly risen. We can now afford many more goods and much higher quality goods. The rate I get on my money market is 5%, what are you getting? Everyone I am friends with is saving a lot, albeit I am in a successful friend group.  I will leave you with two charts below that show real earnings are at all time highs if you exclude the Covid quarter where lower wage workers were laid off. Energy costs have steadily decreased as a percentage of income. 

I agree with your thoughts on housing and medical care though. We need to deregulate each of those industries. We are seeing NIMBY rearing it's head locally right now. 

[Armacing]

On 3/12/2024 at 11:15 AM, samsonh said:

This flies in the face of real world data and lived experiences.  Our standard of living has most certainly risen. We can now afford many more goods and much higher quality goods. The rate I get on my money market is 5%, what are you getting? Everyone I am friends with is saving a lot, albeit I am in a successful friend group.  I will leave you with two charts below that show real earnings are at all time highs if you exclude the Covid quarter where lower wage workers were laid off. Energy costs have steadily decreased as a percentage of income. 

I agree with your thoughts on housing and medical care though. We need to deregulate each of those industries. We are seeing NIMBY rearing it's head locally right now. 

I said housing and medical expenses went up faster than CPI, not fuel.  This is widely known, but here a couple links if you don't already know this:

Medical Cost Inflation:

https://www.healthsystemtracker.org/brief/how-does-medical-inflation-compare-to-inflation-in-the-rest-of-the-economy/#Cumulative%20percent%20change%20in%20Consumer%20Price%20Index%20for%20All%20Urban%20Consumers%20(CPI-U)%20for%20medical%20care%20and%20for%20all%20goods%20and%20services,%20January%202000%20-June%202023

Housing Cost Inflation:

https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/content/v1/579523f003596e94b46ce214/0b6aeb8b-d39e-4ec0-a736-861f11fdc83a/Slide1.JPG?format=2500w

https://www.bankingstrategist.com/housing-prices-hpi-vs-cpi

Also, your income chart is adjusted for CPI, but I'm saying CPI is both rigged to show lower inflation and diluted with products that are not inflating as fast as the categories I mentioned.

And here's the real give-away that you've been chugging the kool-aid way too hard:  Your 2nd chart tracks inflation-adjusted income for *full time employees*.   News flash:  There are a large number of Americans living on fixed incomes, retirement savings, and part-time job incomes that have not kept up with inflation.

See if you can answer this question:  If the Fed wasn't planning to loot the savings of hard-working Americans by devaluing their cash holdings via unlimited money printing, then why did they make owning gold illegal in 1933 and force everyone to turn in their gold in exchange for federal reserve notes?  What were they afraid of?  That Americans would dump the rapidly devaluing federal reserve note and go back to a reliable store of wealth like gold?  That one event is all the proof we need to know that the financial system in America is not designed to promote and protect wealth accumulation by lower income people who often save cash, but rather to perpetuate the wealth of rich people who own a lot of non-cash assets that rise in value with inflation, and also benefit from the expansion of available credit thanks to their access to financing since they are deemed "credit worthy".

[Luvemtall]

First: my post above was never intended to spark any conversation about the economy.   Second: this is not the proper thread to discuss this topic. 

[samsonh]

1 hour ago, Armacing said:

I said housing and medical expenses went up faster than CPI, not fuel.  This is widely known, but here a couple links if you don't already know this:

Medical Cost Inflation:

https://www.healthsystemtracker.org/brief/how-does-medical-inflation-compare-to-inflation-in-the-rest-of-the-economy/#Cumulative%20percent%20change%20in%20Consumer%20Price%20Index%20for%20All%20Urban%20Consumers%20(CPI-U)%20for%20medical%20care%20and%20for%20all%20goods%20and%20services,%20January%202000%20-June%202023

Housing Cost Inflation:

https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/content/v1/579523f003596e94b46ce214/0b6aeb8b-d39e-4ec0-a736-861f11fdc83a/Slide1.JPG?format=2500w

https://www.bankingstrategist.com/housing-prices-hpi-vs-cpi

Also, your income chart is adjusted for CPI, but I'm saying CPI is both rigged to show lower inflation and diluted with products that are not inflating as fast as the categories I mentioned.

And here's the real give-away that you've been chugging the kool-aid way too hard:  Your 2nd chart tracks inflation-adjusted income for *full time employees*.   News flash:  There are a large number of Americans living on fixed incomes, retirement savings, and part-time job incomes that have not kept up with inflation.

See if you can answer this question:  If the Fed wasn't planning to loot the savings of hard-working Americans by devaluing their cash holdings via unlimited money printing, then why did they make owning gold illegal in 1933 and force everyone to turn in their gold in exchange for federal reserve notes?  What were they afraid of?  That Americans would dump the rapidly devaluing federal reserve note and go back to a reliable store of wealth like gold?  That one event is all the proof we need to know that the financial system in America is not designed to promote and protect wealth accumulation by lower income people who often save cash, but rather to perpetuate the wealth of rich people who own a lot of non-cash assets that rise in value with inflation, and also benefit from the expansion of available credit thanks to their access to financing since they are deemed "credit worthy".

Cheers Armacing. You win.  I am not going into conspiracy theory land with you.  Good luck!

[Armacing]

On 3/14/2024 at 11:50 AM, samsonh said:

Cheers Armacing. You win.  I am not going into conspiracy theory land with you.  Good luck!

No theory here, samsonh, just cold hard facts.