[The Transportation and Mass Transit Megathread]

To me, the thing that WeGo misses as a brand outside of the name just sounding like a gimmicky rideshare service is that a city's transit system is so often connected to the area it serves culturally and its riders almost feel pride in it. Go to Atlanta and you can literally see MARTA-inspired merch in shops. Something like that could never happen with the name WeGo and its stale, corporate branding that we've gone with.

[Nashville as MLB Expansion/Relocation Market]

9 hours ago, Baronakim said:

Absolutely in no way is the state going to give up a square inch of land on Bicentennial Mall for a stadium.  The land use is for institutional purposes like museums and art functions like theatre and ballet.  A commercial venture like this would violate the purpose of the mall.  You might as well expect D.C. to tear down the Smithsonian for their sports fans.  Not gonna happen.

 

You're probably right, but it's not as if the Mall has fully lived up to this vision in its current state. Nearly half of the immediate property surrounding it is dedicated to surface parking and the Tennessee Capitol Complex Service Center, which is an incredibly uninviting building. The State has only recently begun showing interest in it. On the other hand, baseball has a huge history in that area and I'd argue that it would be a much better use to help complete the vision for that area than what currently sits there. I think that a park connecting the State Capitol, State Museum, City Farmer's Market, State Library, and an MLB Park would be oddly cohesive and instantly become an awesome neighborhood specifically for locals, which Nashville could definitely use. 

[Nashville as MLB Expansion/Relocation Market]

My skepticism with some of these rumors aside, I will say that in regards to a potential stadium, my dream has now become First Horizon Park being renovated and expanded to support MLB as well. It's such a perfect location with the skyline view to the North, the proximity to downtown and the fact that it is already so nicely nestled in the urban neighborhood. Not to mention, it could result in an easier sell to Nashvillians as well due to the chance for reduced costs and infrastructure already being in place for the most part. You would be a bit more landlocked with Brooklyn Bowl, Third & Home, and the new Ballpark Village apartments being constructed around the North & East sides of the stadium, but I believe that there could still be some room for growth as well due to the rather barebones garage that currently sits behind right field and the currently very underutilized State property and parking lots on Rep. John Lewis Way. 

I realize that it would pose some unique challenges, but I guess this vision really originates from when I went to watch a game at Wrigley Field this summer. The surrounding area, the scenery, and the overall community feel of the Ballpark all combined together to create something truly unique and I had some of the most fun I have ever had at a sports game. Not to directly compare Wrigleyville to Germantown, but I think that there are similarities there in the Residential/Retail focus of the area that could really result in a more authentic Nashville experience than simply trying to start from scratch and create something entirely new like the Braves have done.

[Nashville as MLB Expansion/Relocation Market]

The current White Sox stadium lease does not expire until 6 years from now I believe, so there's a bit of time before something like this could even become reality. It still feels like a pretty textbook ploy from ownership for receiving public funds to support a new stadium development to me, but I also feel we've clearly become the number 1 choice on MLB's radar with the Las Vegas A's seemingly becoming a done deal.

[Project Thread/New Construction/Photo du jour/Const. CAMs]

41 minutes ago, nashville born said:

Still one of my favorite towers ever.  So stylish; so grand; so unique.  Will always be a beauty to me.  Just ready for it to no longer be our tallest!

It catches a lot of flack around here simply for being our tallest for over 30 years now, but without it, our skyline instantly becomes really boring and pedestrian. We just need a couple of more daring designs alongside it to push things further. 

[Soccer in Nashville]

 

We have a ton to be proud of, Nashville really was the better team for the vast majority of that game. Credit to their goalie and of course, Messi, for that insane goal. I unfortunately could not afford tickets, but the atmosphere was electric even on TV. This stands out to me as as one of the most exciting sporting events that this city has ever hosted.

[New Titans Stadium (60,000 capacity dome, ground level retail, directly east of Nissan Stadium)]

4 hours ago, NashRugger said:

I want just about as seamless integration into a surrounding neighborhood you can get, granted it does not exist at all right now, but I'd like a little more "bang" in the design versus this Playstation turned on its side.  But then again, I guess I'm more of a big purist for a big, hulking stadium but I can certainly do without a sea of asphalt. 

Obviously these are not final renderings & designs, so I'll await full judgement until then. 

It's my understanding that the Stadium design itself is pretty close to finalized, it's more the surrounding areas that remain visionary right now.

[New Tennessee Performing Arts Center (TPAC), $500 million, 3,200 seats, 1,500 seats, 500 seats, site unknown]

Personally I think this may easily be Nashville's ugliest highrise, but demolishing a building that's only a couple of decades old seems a bit wasteful if the structure is truly still holding up. 

[Fairgrounds Speedway Racetrack expansion to 30,000 seats]

13 minutes ago, Argo said:

I'm just noticing the difference in reactions between the baseball project and the fairgrounds project. No need to get defensive because you have less thought for the people of Bordeaux than the fairgrounds area. Whatever "reason" that would be.

So I'll say a couple things here- baseball and racing are two very different sports. Baseball may be the quietest of all major sports due to how many breaks are built in to the game. There will still be a lot to discuss regarding  traffic and other logistics if that project ever happens, but NASCAR brings on additional concerns that baseball will not. Another difference would be that this project is up for debate right now and can become reality very soon, whereas the Nashville Stars proposal still lacks a lot of necessary funding and any sort of commitment from MLB. There are concrete details and renderings for this plan, while an MLB Stadium being built in North Nashville is merely a suggestion still. I understand what you're meaning to imply and I take things of that nature very seriously, but it's not an apt comparison and you're really reaching in trying to draw parallels between the two situations as they currently stand. 

[Fairgrounds Speedway Racetrack expansion to 30,000 seats]

On 7/29/2023 at 1:15 PM, titanhog said:

The Fairgrounds track used to be a NASCAR track…for many decades, until Nashville let it slip through their hands in the mid-80s.  It is NOT a small city track…it is similar to the size of Bristol and several other tracks without the seating.

It currently seats about 15k…and they want to rebuild the stands to seat 30k (unlike the 100k+ that Bristol can seat).  It’s not like they’re going to suddenly turn this into a mega-track.  They’ll have a top level NASCAR race there ONCE every TWO years.  They’ll improve the sound barriers (that are almost non-existent now).  And…even if this deal falls through, the track IS NOT going away and will continue to host the same amount of races it always has…AND the city (citizens of Nashville) will have to pay yearly for upgrades.

I think it’s one thing for citizens to complain about the cost of a potential deal…but for citizens to act as if someone is coming in and building a brand new NASCAR track in a residential neighborhood (how DARE they! **shaking fist**) would actually be laughable if not for the fact that’s EXACTLY what many are believing.

In the end, I have a feeling the residents in that area will wake up one day with the same-ol’ subpar track with the same-ol’ 10+ races a year and upkeep paid for yearly from their own pockets.

That's fair, you are right that it will certainly still be smaller than the largest Superspeedways. However, downplaying these proposed changes as though they will not result in significant increases to the level of noise, vibration, traffic, and overall disruption of the races here for neighbors is just not accurate. These renovations will attract more and larger racing events for better and for worse. Boiling down concerns over that as simply being attributed to misinformation or blind NIMBYism is, again, unfair in my opinion.

 

2 hours ago, Bos2Nash said:

So you are okay with the Titans building in the urban core because they are building next door, but not okay with this facility tearing down it's un-inclusive facilities and rebuilding on the same exact spot? The infrastructure is in place for a racetrack, it is an existing venue that is getting improved within the same footprint (actually condensed because of the 10-acre land giveaway to a different billionaire ownership group).

Some of the older fans will claim the new cars and/or muffler use detracts from this experience, but having been to both old and new car races the rumble is still very much there. The excitement of those cars is very much still there. While I haven't experienced the mufflers on the cars (only run at LA Coliseum and Chicago Street Race) it is a compromise I would be willing to make to be able to not drive 45 minutes, parking 1/2 mile away and then sit in 90 minutes of traffic to get out of. I have transportation options to get to the venue and still have a great racing experience. Clearly the Nascar fans are willing to make this compromise too seeing as the races are selling out and Nascar is seeing some of their largest crowds in a decade.

For my first point, I think that you're oversimplifying what I'm saying. The Fairgrounds track hasn't been used for NASCAR in decades, whereas the Titans play on the East Bank now. There is a NASCAR Superspeedway that we already have right now that is being underutilized. Why would we not start there? I don't think locals should be on the bad end of this deal because NASCAR's event model has grown stale and their leadership wants to shake things up to get fans interested again. I certainly understand the headaches surrounding the potential logistics of attending such a race in Lebanon, but that is what NASCAR races have required since forever. It's one of the reasons that I do not love racing, but I see having to drive a bit further out as one of the prices you pay when the sport you're watching entails loud race cars doing laps for hours. 

Don't get me wrong, you both lay out good points and I hope I don't sound too combative. If the charter is truly written in a way that racing must be a part of the Fairgrounds and if we don't accept this deal with NASCAR then locals will be footing the bill for more renovations, then I can see the positives. I just don't ever think that saying "well, this area has been used for this purpose for many years" is ever a good way to think about things in cities, especially in one as dynamic as Nashville is right now. With that same philosophy, we'd still have industry on the downtown riverfront, farmland where West End is now, etc. If the charter could be rewritten so that something like this can't be dangled over our heads, I would certainly be interested in that. If racing must stay, then I can accept this as a decent compromise as well I suppose. 

[Fairgrounds Speedway Racetrack expansion to 30,000 seats]

13 hours ago, donNdonelson2 said:

And the race track has been there for 100 years. It’s sorta like people who buy near the airport bemoaning the sound of planes taking off. (And I live near the airport. I don’t yell at the planes.)

I don't agree with this characterization, I see it as more equivalent to buying a house near a small private plane airport before being told that there is a push to upgrade it into a full service International Airport. The idea that residents should have always anticipated NASCAR taking interest in a small city track that radically differs from their traditional track model is completely unfair in my opinion. 

 

19 hours ago, Bos2Nash said:

Clearly thinking, why shouldn't we have driven 30 miles for Soccer before it was built? What about letting the Titans move 30 miles outside of downtown instead of building a new $2 billion stadium? What about Major League Baseball? All three are major sports that came to town decades after the racetrack, use/used public funds (or potential public funds) to get built. Again, the biggest hurdle that the naysayers cant really answer or workaround is this is an established entity. If it was new, I would be alot more agreeable,  but it isn't. If nothing happens, the racing continues. The noise of the local racing continues. Nashville is still charter bound to upgrade the venue (which is supposedly $41 million?). Nashville is still in legal jeopardy because the facility isn't ADA compliant. While I still disagree with the financing, what the deal brings itself improves conditions around the track.

The contract for the superspeedway potentially expires after next year and I am pretty sure the deal for racing will only be for every  other year (at least for cup), so really Nashville will just be walking away from the revenue. Just like they did in the 80's. I'm not sure exactly what the deals in place for Trucks/Xfinity are. Presumably, Xfinity and Trucks would move the contract to the Fairgrounds fully with the next contract or leave the region entirely.

I agree that I prefer sports venues be near the core of the city and exist as a part of the urban fabric, but none of the other entities you refer to had their venue already built that far away. Nissan Stadium and the Superspeedway are a bit comparable admittedly because both are only ~20 years old while reportedly needing extensive renovations, but the Titans are building the new stadium virtually on-site where the infrastructure already exists, why shouldn't NASCAR do the same? Additionally, nearly every other speedway on the NASCAR circuit is at least that far away (if not much further)  from dense population centers because they are incredibly disruptive events. They can provide promises about mufflers and sound walls all day, but there is no way to make large stock car races that are not going to be disruptive to the neighboring residents. That noise and vibration is also one of the bigger appeals of attending races from what I've heard, so if this is truly as effective as they promise, why are people going to want to go to these races at all? I am just so incredibly skeptical about any of the sound mitigation promises, especially when considering that this track is pretty much a completely unprecedented concept within the sport. 

[Inside 440 - Berry Hill, Midtown, Vanderbilt, 12S, WeHo, Fairgrounds, etc.]

22 minutes ago, Bos2Nash said:

Don't know if these have been posted, but some renderings pulled from the ePermit.

Exterior Perspectives. Primary cladding on ground floor is bamboo and above that is a metal panel. The white (non-public facing) wall is a stucco finish

Interior Perspectives:

That's a lot different than the initial monochrome black exterior they shared for this one, thanks for passing it along! The rounded edges on this one are super nice, really elevates the design.

[PRIME/801 Church St. (38 stories, 456', 358 units, 2,654 sq. ft. retail, 511 capacity garage)]

25 minutes ago, Luvemtall said:

I see what you’re saying, the rendering has 4 “ boxes “ above the pedestal. And it appears to have only 3 in last picture above 

Does anyone have insight on this? 

I'm no expert here, but it's only around ~24 stories above the parking pedestal based on my count, so that figure could be based on that.

I will say that Alcove turned out impressively similar to its rendering, so I believe that this one will be the same and have at least one more set of floors to complete the syncopated boxes effect.

[133 KVB (two 49 story towers of 574’ & 512’ featuring condos, apartments, hotel, ground level retail, public park & 8 levels of parking)]

Is there any reason that a large amount of public green spaces are being emphasized for the large tower developments in this area? Don't get me wrong, I'm not complaining, I just notice that this project, the Park Place development, and the Cumulus Radio site project all feature more or less the same basic layout with large areas of green space surrounding taller skyscrapers. There's not some kind of design overlay dictating that is there?

[Fairgrounds Speedway Racetrack expansion to 30,000 seats]

On 7/2/2023 at 12:56 PM, samsonh said:

The race in Chicago this weekend has abysmal attendance. Amazing how far nascar has fallen unpopularity.

In fairness to that event, there has been torrential rain and flooding all throughout Chicago for the past few days. I still don't think that the attendance for this would have been great in perfect weather, but those factors certainly had an affect. When strictly comparing the highlights of that race to the average NASCAR Superspeedway race, the street race looked infinitely more exciting.

That said, my personal opinion of NASCAR simply being a bad product shouldn't matter. I just don't see a racetrack located in a dense, growing urban neighborhood as a good idea and any comparisons to draw on for it are pretty much non existent for a reason. There is some history with the track that predates many of the neighbors now, I get it, but frankly nothing too noteworthy. It was also allowed to virtually decay over the past few decades and any historic charm that could have been preserved is long gone.

In my opinion, I think that the best course of action would be to just demolish it and reconfigure the property for further development, an alternative event venue, greenspace, a WeGo transit hub, etc. You name it, I think there are probably 20 better uses for that property than a NASCAR track. Then, if NASCAR truly wants to increase their presence in Nashville, devote these resources to improving the Wilson County Superspeedway or even host a street race here like they just did in Chicago, I think that could be a lot of fun. I just think that investing in NASCAR (a sport that is dying by most measurables) over amenities for the residents of one of Nashville's fastest growing new neighborhoods would be a mistake.

[Project Thread/New Construction/Photo du jour/Const. CAMs]

Here's some new aerial footage of Downtown courtesy of the NHL!

 

 

[Inner Loop - CBD, Downtown, East Bank, Germantown, Gulch, Rutledge]

8 minutes ago, natethegreat said:

Where are the million dollar single family homes on that block??? It’s all fences and warehouses. I agree it’s a good mission, but it’s out of control. I can’t walk down that street without getting harassed, it’s like a zombie movie. It’s a bad look. Circle South and Ritz have failed to get off the ground, I might know a reason why.

The delays and/or failures of those projects have absolutely nothing to do with the homeless down there, there are literally multiple apartment towers nearing completion just a block or two away from the Mission, along with several more on the way.

Homelessness is a complicated issue (much more complicated than you're making it seem) and I really don't think it's fair to dehumanize these people that have been failed by our society in many ways. Yes, nobody should fear being harassed when walking around the city, but simply demolishing the Mission and moving it elsewhere will not magically solve that problem. 

[Fairgrounds Speedway Racetrack expansion to 30,000 seats]

50 minutes ago, Nash_12South said:

(cynically) I think the sound attenuation measures won't have any real affect. Do you thing a "sound wall" around a spot like Ascend would have any real affect? I know there are other measures, but have other areas had measurable success with them, with results from other than proponents of racing? 

I totally agree, it really seems like a false promise that they're putting at the front of the deal to get it passed. The idea that retaining walls will be all it takes to make these races not disruptive just seems impossible. In theory if this were passed and allowed to come to fruition, it's not like there will be any way to hold them accountable to their claims of sound reduction.

The reality is that NASCAR is desperately trying to rebrand itself right now for new generations of fans, and they see the historic track and its unique location within the city as a potential new way to freshen up their model among a population that is rapidly turning toward F1. That said, there are obvious reasons that none of these Speedways are located near people anymore. NASCAR races are some of the loudest events in the world, and asking locals to overlook that multiple times a year for the sake of the nostalgia of some (the vast majority of who will never have to deal with the consequences of living next to the track) is a bit ridiculous in my opinion. It's understandable that they want a piece of that Nashville Sports event excitement, but I'm seriously skeptical this is the best way to get that.

[Tempo Hotel, 127 Rosa Parks, 16 story, 295 room hotel, 6,500 sq. ft. retail, 200 capacity garage, ground level retail]

I've been really impressed with this building due to how quickly it has gone up as well as the design finishes turning out better than I expected them to be. It has a sort of mid century flair and sticks out in a cool away amongst its surroundings.

[New Titans Stadium (60,000 capacity dome, ground level retail, directly east of Nissan Stadium)]

It's honestly not really a shock that there are likely plans to add a Sportsbook at the stadium when you look around within the industry. Pretty much every new venue will be adding them and many already established venues are already beginning to look into how to incorporate them into their space. Sports gambling is already a massive money maker and a Sportsbook will be a big incentive to attending games in person.

[Inside 440 - Berry Hill, Midtown, Vanderbilt, 12S, WeHo, Fairgrounds, etc.]

On 4/19/2023 at 12:02 PM, DMilner said:

 

Demolition has now begun on this building. The neighborhood is just covered in construction now, will be one of the most exciting areas in Nashville before long.

[IKEA to Nashville]

I would still love to have a store, I feel much more comfortable seeing certain furniture items in person rather than putting all of my trust in online images. I have also shopped at the Memphis store and while it is nice, it's just a little bit far for a day trip when you consider the maze-like store layout. Outside of those personal reasons, I also just think that the Nashville market would support it better.

[New Titans Stadium (60,000 capacity dome, ground level retail, directly east of Nissan Stadium)]

I can appreciate the sentiment of what that guy is doing but I just don't think it would be as functional as what the team has proposed. It really reminds me of something from the 60's with the big sweeping plazas and big arches surrounding the field. It looks nice, but it will suffer from the same issues as the current stadium (wasteland outside of gamedays, no mixed use or integration into East Nashville) and who's to say how this will age aesthetically in the future? Again, it's a grand vision that's fun to look at, but the proposed design takes a drastically different design philosophy that I think is way better for the city's urban fabric.

[Rise East Nashville/800 Main (2 - 10 stories, 376 apts., 50,540 sq. ft. office, 46,210 sq. ft. retail, 316 capacity garage, one acre outdoor space)]

1 hour ago, MLBrumby said:

Agree!  So what would they rather have.... a nice looking apartment block or a gravel parking lot packed with U-Haul trucks?  

You joke but a lot of disgruntled locals may take you up on keeping the gravel lot...

[Nashville Warehouse Co. (formerly Outpost Nashville), 10 stories & other structures, 275 apts, 200,000 sq. ft. office space, $176 million]

The brickwork will elevate this one so much, you can tell with the small details like the archways on the first floor and the subtle framing around the edges. It will be a very timeless building that somehow just feels like it belongs in the neighborhood.