Khorasaurus1

I totally agree about Bradford...so why don't you think they will upgrade it/be willing to pay to upgrade it? And MDOT will really need to add the 96 to 196 ramp, because otherwise anyone going to WB 196 from Spectrum HQ will end up on Bradford. They basically have to open up Leffingwell to Leonard to 96 to 196 as an option. Also, bus upgrades will be necessary. The 15 should probably serve this facility and Cornerstone and terminate at Meijer Gardens. Leaving a need for a new downtown-to-Knapp's Corner route. And there is probably a need for a Beltline Express service, too. This location is in the City limits, and will require investments from City, Regional, and State entities. And Spectrum should shoulder some of that burden. Or stay downtown where the infrastructure already exists.

It seems to me that some road upgrades are going to be needed to support this - Bradford is going to need to be upgraded to a full intersection with the Beltline (which the residents living east of there will probably HATE, unless they work at Spectrum), and I think this really should be the trigger for MDOT to add a EB 96 to WB 196 ramp. And frankly I think Spectrum should have to pay for those upgrades, which would alter their pro-forma quite a bit.

Anyone else think we need some new traffic lights in Heartside, especially once Studio Park opens? Those four way stops are already becoming problematic, including for pedestrians. I'm thinking: Grandville/Oakes Grandville/Cherry Commerce/Oakes Commerce/Cherry Ionia/Oakes Ottawa/Oakes (once Ottawa becomes a through street) North of Fulton in the downtown area, we have traffic lights at basically every intersection. Heartside is now vibrant enough (more vibrant than "Center City" in some places) that it needs the same treatment.

Presumably Bridgewater will fill up fast, too? Especially given how vibrant Stockbridge has become, and the fact that it has dedicated parking. They may need to renovate a little to get rid of the Gordon Gecko vibe in the lobby, though.

The City is working on a new City-wide Master Plan, so there may be one associated with that.

Detroit seems to have figured this out. They have The Belt, the new alley at the Shinola Hotel, and even a trendy cocktail lounge that fronts the alley Eminem walks down at the end of 8 Mile. The solution seems to be consolidating all of the dumpsters into one enclosed area and generating enough activity that the alley isn't a secluded place for the homeless anymore. Plus the designers of Studio Park were clearly anticipating that alley being a focal point, so just leaving dumpsters there seems like a waste.

Does the pedestrian way that will run from Fulton, down past the arena, and into the heart of Studio Park have a name? If not, should it get one? Relatedly, does the walkway between Venue Tower and 50 Monroe have a name? That was the historic location of Ferry Street, so maybe something related to that?

Not sure I agree with "foreseeable future." Seems to be that site will be in the next "generation" of projects, whether that comes up next year or after the next recession or something. It's just too good of a site.

Yeah, the 70s era building was designed to be entered from the atrium in the middle - i.e. from the parking lots on either side, not from Monroe or Ottawa. The thought process from the 60s-70s is pretty obvious in retrospect. It's almost like they bulldozed the dime store block, built the new Monroe Ave, pedestrian mall, and the amphitheater, and then said "uh oh, there are big old buildings visible from the Mall and all the way up at Grand Center and City Hall"..."well, then let's tear down those too"..."eh, there's more old crappy buildings and a power plant on the other side of them"..."ok, then we need to make them look modern."

I was standing in front of DeVos Place the other day and looking south at this project, and it occurred to me why they covered these buildings in the first place. The Ottawa and Monroe frontages were beautiful, and their restoration, even if not perfect, is definitely a step forward for those corridors. But the north side of the buildings is VERY visible. It forms a terminal vista on Monroe and a backdrop to Rosa Parks Circle. And they weren't designed to be that visible. When they were built, there were buildings on Louis, and obviously Herzburg's and the Dime Store Block where RPC is today. The de-skinning has added some urgency to developing the parking lot at Monroe and Louis, to cover up the common brick (in addition to enclosing RPC with more vibrancy and getting rid of a high-profile surface lot).

Huh, that's interesting. Cummings' foresight is a big part of why Van Andel Arena is one of the only sports/entertainment venues in the country that actually created sustainable redevelopment in the surrounding area.

It was three floors so that three different levels of the parking garage would connect to three different floors of the mall. Because the floors didn't quite line up, there were stairs within the skywalk.

Those ramps to 131 made sense with the rail yard, I guess. But as the rail yard disappeared they made less and less sense. Was the ramp from Fulton gone by the time of the Killer Donuts picture? The buildings in the Killer Donuts picture are in better shape than I was expecting for that era. 1 Ionia and the Blodgett Building don't look that different than they look today. The San Chez building is red, but also looks to be well cared for. I guess I had it in my head that they looked like the BOB or Arena Station did back then. Not sure why.

It wasn't the core in the late 70s though. Calder Plaza was the core, the area south of Monroe Center was mainly parking for Monroe Center, and everything south of Fulton was derelict. At 12 stories, it probably felt like looming blight, especially in an era when much more architecturally interesting buildings were considered obsolete.

Hang on, the S-Curve can't be original concrete. It was completely torn down from Wealthy to Pearl and re-built from scratch in the late 90s...

The train garage explains the weird ramp from 131 to Oakes. The present configuration makes a lot more sense, but when it was built, the railyard/station/train garages were still there and the ramp needed to go over and around them. Was that exit orginally envisioned to connect into the Ionia/Ottawa one way system?

Looks like construction trailers for the arena? Ah, so like West Foxtown in Detroit, except without sporting events to fill the parking spaces a few times per year. So you could stand at Ottawa and Louis and see the S-Curve??

That's funny, because I have a bunch of downtown memories from that era - eating at Ole Tacos and riding the train in the basement of City Center/Mackie's World, eating at Zack's Diner on Monroe Center, ice skating at the Monroe Amphitheater, going to the old Public Museum and the new Van Andel Museum, the old layout of the Ford Museum where everyone went through the exhibit backwards, Hoops games at Welsh Auditorium, fancy dinners at the Pen Club, and shows at DeVos Hall or Civic Theater or St. Cecilias. I also have vivid memories of broken windows on streets running south from Fulton, and thinking "Ransom" and "LaGrave" were scary names for streets, which fit because there were scary buildings in that area. But I have big gaps. I have no recollection of anything west of City Center on Fulton, for instance, which is why I'm curious what the arena site was like pre-arena. And I don't remember the pedestrian mall, even though I must have experienced it.

Huh, I thought Plaza Towers was earlier. I would have been old enough to notice something that dramatic by the mid-90s, and yet I have no memory of it.

I found this fascinating aerial from the 90s. The link says 1996, but I think it must be sooner than that because the Plaza Towers re-skinning is in progress and Van Andel Arena doesn't look like it's finished? Some things that caught my eye: The old S-Curve with the weird ramps to the corner of Oakes and Ionia. Did Oakes not go through? And neither did Cherry? That is just a ton of wasted land where Central Station, Heartside Park, and Studio Park are now. I know it was a rail yard historically (and the S-curve didn't help), but jeez. I don't remember that part of town pre-arena...did the dead zone go all the way to Fulton from the time the train depot was torn out until the building of the Arena? It's amazing that that dinky truck terminal is now the ever-growing headquarters of an internationally renowned brewery. While I know from childhood memories that the Ionia, Commerce, and Division corridors were almost completely derelict back then, at least most of the built environment was kept in tact, paving the way for the revitalized Heartside we know today. The GRPD was...Mackie's World at this point...right? The old parking garage where UICA is now is still there. Does anyone remember (or have pictures of??) the crazy three-level skywalk across Fulton? I think that was gone by the time of this picture, but I have a really vivid memories of it, and I would have been a preschooler when it existed. Other observations?

I disagree. A building with tenants (residential or commercial) = people who interact with the rest of the city. A building without tenants, even well maintained, and even with first floor tenants, isn't much better than any empty lot for adding vitality to the city. For an example, watch what happens when the Broderick Tower renovations in Detroit are completed. That building has generally had first floor tenants with the rest vacant for about 30 years, and doesn't look particularly blighted (at least from a distance), but there's going to be a huge difference is the number of people out and about in the Grand Circus area once the apartment dwellers move in.

This could be very very good or very very bad. Low income housing is necessary, but Monroe Center really isn't the right place for a Federall-subsidized 100% low income facility. Hopefully the owners put some money into the place and charge market rent so that a nice mix of tenants moves in. They may even be able to get some Low Income Housing Tax Credits for the renovation if they reserve some of the units for low income. Any scenario like that would be a win for MC as Morton House becomes a housing option for a broader swath of the population. Of course, there is a also the potential for disaster. If the current owners don't have the money to put into the building or they sell it to someone who doesn't care about it, it end up going completely dark, which would create a huge black hole right in the center of downtown. I suspect the most likely scenario is the CWD or Locus snatch it up cheap, do some minor (first floor, please!) renovations and start renting it at a level slightly below their current properties to the south.