vtfan18

Slightly off topic but relates to perception of light rail and mass transit U.S. cities scrambling to meet rising mass transit demands

I'm already preparing myself for disappointment. The minute I read "recreation center", horrible images of the suburbs flashed in my head. Rec centers take up a lot of land, which does NOT = best use. I'd rather see more open green space than another brick box looking YMCA. Norfolk is also going to have a very difficult time convincing business owners to set up shop there if they plan to replace all the subsidized units. I don't know why Norfolk keeps touting Broad Creek as a success when its clear that many of the for market units are still unsold.

Chipotle is my favorite and the new location near Town Center seems to be doing very well. I've eaten there a number of times already and they are always busy with long lines. I hope this location does well and they open up more locations across the region.

Norfolk has had the same uninspiring architecture for many years. In my opinion, this is party because Norfolk has turned to one consultant to provide the vision for the city who will ultimately have too much influence over the design of the Kirn lot. Denver is currently going through the same process of deciding what to do with their Union Station, similar to the Kirn site for Light Rail. Although Denver's project is significantly larger. Norfolk could learn a few lessons. Denver has recently narrowed down their four finalist consulting firms to design the public space. Norfolk should do the same thing, by letting firms compete over design, you ultimately end up with a better product as opposed to letting Ray and his old school firm suggest any design they want. He gets paid way to much to tell Norfolk citizens stuff we already know. Want an indirect means of marketing Norfolk and Hampton Roads? Allow world class design firms to comptete over sites like the Kirn lot. Its just another way to bring recognition to our area. Denver citizens formed an advocacy group allowing their citizens a voice in design and function. The difference here being they formed a group just for this project. Whereas DNC seems to want to pick their fingers in everything meanwhile not really accomplishing much. If anyone is interested to read how Denver is handling their project. I've attached a link to Denverinfill's blog. http://www.denverinfill.com/blog/index.html

That's cool. I've seen and read a lot about this by the graffiti research lab. If anyone is interested in checking this out. I've attached a link. They do some cool work and have even been showcased by the Museum of Modern Art in New York City. http://graffitiresearchlab.com/

I honestly think Waterside has become the Pembroke Mall of Norfolk. In my mind, you'll never change my perception of the mall regardless of the amount of renovation or improvement you do unless it is torn down. I know many other people feel the same way, it just has a bad stigma associated with it. Unfortunately, somtimes you need a fresh start to reach full potential. I think there's a great opportunity for mixed use at Waterside and expand on the public space. For Norfolk to be more vibrant in areas outside of Granby, you need to create more pedestrian traffic during all hours of the day and not just at night with the bars in Waterside. It needs to be a 24 hours destination and not just a 9pm - 2am destination. I think the city can find the right mix of office, residential, and park space to the current location. In my opinion, Waterside just needs to go.

I'll first say other cities who are scarce on land put up office towers on lots that size. New York definitely has towers on small lots. But anyway, this rendering is classis Ray Gindroz, he has mastered this type of style and design and puts it down in everyone of his projects. It's nothing unique or special. I'm not even going to say anything about the style, you all know I dislike the small town classic look that we so often try to replicate here in Norfolk. I'm just happy to see light rail and agree with the Kevin Murphy from the DNC, it needs more personality! The clock tower has got to go!

mmmm...Chipotle is sooo good! I've been waiting for years for them to come. I wish they would open one in downtown Norfolk but I'll take one in Va Beach. This was also announced in the latest issue of Inside Business.

The above could be said for many future projects but its not any reason to jump for joy just because someone is developing "something" which "is better than a hole in the ground." I think many residents have gotten to the point where they expect better design, and shouldn't we all demand something better? Who isn't tired of seeing the same office and condo building sprout up all over town? The city needs ambitious, innovative architecture - it makes cities young and compelling! The perfect example of life imitating art, the life of the streets creates the soul of the city.

Trying to subdue my frustration with this horrible looking building, I can't help but laugh when I realize this building is a modern day version of Bobby Wright's property at 517 Front St in Fort Norfolk. It somehow reminds me of that big abandoned warehouse. I'll honestly be surprised if anyone praises this building for its design. Unfortunately, the lady commenting on the Pilot article doesn't realize, we're not against the building's use, we just hate the design!

I'm no longer of the "better than another hole in the ground" camp. Yes, another project for Norfolk to put down on the books and perhaps the complex will create a few jobs. But the price of developable land is so scarce in Norfolk; we

I agree. I've said before that Norfolk needs a new approach, and that is allowing a developer to create a master plan. They should allow firms from all over the country to participate in an RFP process and pick the best master plan. This would allow a developer to take advantage of economies of scale and do grander, bolder projects that would not have financially worked just given a single project. This needs to happen for Fort Norfolk and most importantly Saint Pauls.

Definitely not the best use of land. The project design was horrible anyway. It looked like Alcatraz and I have a feeling it'll only get worse in an effort to decrease cost in this type of market. I agree, Norfolk should hold off until a better opportunity comes along. If I'm giving the land away, I want to make sure I'm getting something great in return for the citizens of Norfolk, not another subpar office building.

EQ3 is hit and miss for me. I like the style but the quality is sometimes lacking. I wouldn't furnish my entire place in EQ3 stuff but you can definitely find a few items of good quality and price. Decorum is almost the same way, but much more expensive.

Skip Macy's and go to Bergdorf Goodman. It'll blow you away, just make sure to visit the mens Bergdorf Goodman as there are two. Actually Macy's is fun if you like running around in a maze. Its so easy to get lost in that place!

I will say that as plain as MacArthur mall is with its stores, its definitely the nicest mall in our area. I haven't been to lynnhaven mall for some time and after a recent visit, I couldn't believe how fast that mall dropped in my book. A great deal of "mom and pop" stores but even stores like footlocker had the worst build out I had ever seen.

Point taken. Just trying to illustrate major differences between Norfolk and other housing authorities. However, continue to develop every housing project to look like broad creek and you'll continue to get the same results.

Here are some renderings of a mixed income rental development under construction now in Denver by the Denver Housing Authority. Its a redevelopment project of a former public housing complex. Similar concept of Broad Creek just completely different style. This is along the lines of what Norfolk needs downtown in St Pauls to meet the needs of current residents and change the face of the area attracting business and future development. I wish NRHA would think outside the box when it comes to design like other housing authorites. The following is a picture of a another project by DHA on the homepage of their website. Just goes to show how forward thinking they are with the projects.

fo'sho'

Again, I sometimes question if our officials ever went to college. This is a classic example of public economics and on the most basic level they should understand that a skatepark on prime city owned land does not benefit the common household as tax generating office towers or residential development would do. Any cost benefit analysis would show this isn't the most efficient space for a skatepark. I grew up skateboarding and don't have any problem with building a skatepark. Other large cities have built skateparks in the middle of their downtown's but they aren't built on waterfront property and these are cities with much larger tracts of land to develop. Norfolk is so limited in futher development that its almost absurd to take up 4 acres of prime land. In addition, a skatepark can be built on land just over an acre just as this 50,000 square feet one is in Denver. It's designed for vertical skating and street skating mimicking an urban environment of planters, curbs, rails, bowls, and more. There is a ten-foot-deep "dog bowl" and a half-pipe. We should NOT follow in Virginia Beach's footsteps by trying to build the same thing they already have. Put something like this in the Saint Paul's district if they want it close to downtown.

I beleive Norfolk should let the private sector cast their proposals for Saint Paul's just like the dome site for Va Beach. If you let the consultant "tell" you what should be there you limit the possiblities of great use for the area. I definitely think it should be a master plan developed by one firm. Let them utilize economies of scale to bring a higher end product that may not be available if they piece it together.

I wish the city would do a better job educating the public and vocally expressing the long range plans for light rail. Average citizens still think its just a 7 mile line to and from no where. Thats all the newspaper can focus upon, not the long term vision and plans. Average citizens don't understand light rail must be built in phases and that studies have shown ridership levels dramatically increase after the second and third phases are built. An extreme case but new york's subway line wasn't built all at once and thats what people don't seem to understand. I overheard a number of people on the street talking about light rail during the illumination of lights parade and they totally had their facts wrong!

Reminds me of an area of Denver undergoing the same type development. The city bid out the land to a number of developers to build the entire parcel. The development company did a first rate job and designed the entire area with a master plan. If you scroll the entire page, it'll list all the developments within this particular area. Saint Paul's should be one master plan urban neighborhood. http://www.ewpartners.com/development_location.aspx?id=2 A little bit of side news, got back from a business trip to Bahrain not too long ago. I took some pics of the massive developments going on there. Not on par with Dubai but still very very impressive! I'll post pics when I get a sec.

Funny thing about Ray, he gets paid a ton to tell Norfolk citizens things we already know!

fo sho'...Broad Creek in my estimation was a disaster. The development was nice b/c it spruced up the area but the concept of mixed income doesn't fly with the masses and it takes the masses to embrace something like this for it to work. Not to say it can't work but Hampton Roads is not an area where people are exactly open minded and forward thinking. Something like this may have worked in San Fran but not here. So if they think they can put another Broad Creek in downtown, they are completely blind. From what I've already seen of the tentative plans...I can tell you I'm already disappointed.