Providence Sports

[mod134]

Yes. The web site is www.champcarworldseries.com. Upcoming races are televised on SPEED Channel - owned by Fox - and NBC.

[Cotuit]

I will post this in the Sports thread. Didn't realize there was one.

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I can move this there. It's a good read, the sports thread.

[Baines]

Black and grey, huh? A pretty strong color combination, especially if I add white for edging purposes.

Is that all?

I sense a pattern here...

Anyway, I've got to get all the information together so I can begin the history of the league. If there were no sports leagues in Providence during the years 1886-1898, Providence doesn't have a sports team at all in any league until... 1924 or so. Is that right?

Anyway, thanks for all the help so far.

- Zaximillian

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Providence Grays major league baseball...Babe Ruth played for them

RI Reds became the Providence Reds hockey...when the AHL was very strong (not owned by NHL types)

The New Engand Patriots are really a Providence team as they play in Foxboro...I wish the stadium had made it here.

[Loughlin]

Providence Grays major league baseball...Babe Ruth played for them

RI Reds became the Providence Reds hockey...when the AHL was very strong (not owned by NHL types)

The New Engand Patriots are really a Providence team as they play in Foxboro...I wish the stadium had made it here.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It would have been awful if they went to Providence, mass is the only place they should be, the center of new england.

[Griswald]

It would have been awful if they went to Providence, mass is the only place they should be, the center of new england.

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Providence is only 20 minutes from where the Patriots play now....and Foxboro is not the center of New England. I don't think owners decide where they want their stadiums by picking the most central part of the state or region or whatever. They want to find a place where they can make the most money without having to spend a ton of money or time on logistics.

[Cotuit]

Providence is only 20 minutes from where the Patriots play now....and Foxboro is not the center of New England.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It's not the geographic center, but it's pretty damn close to being the population center, and right on target as the population center if you consider that western Connecticut is more in the New York sports market than the New England one. And it's greatly situated along major highways that facilitate the largest number of fans being able to easily reach it. If Gillette Stadium were in Boston, Providence, or Hartford it would be less easily accessible to less people.

[Baines]

It's not the geographic center, but it's pretty damn close to being the population center, and right on target as the population center if you consider that western Connecticut is more in the New York sports market than the New England one. And it's greatly situated along major highways that facilitate the largest number of fans being able to easily reach it. If Gillette Stadium were in Boston, Providence, or Hartford it would be less easily accessible to less people.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Exactly...as I stated in the Hartford-Providence thread, Kraft used Hartford (where he would never have gone) to leverage Boston and Proviidence and ended up right where they want to be --- in a suburb of PROVIDENCE...but close enough to the Boston Metro.

It has absolutely nothing to do with Massaachusetts. Pro teams locate in population centers - not states. They are in a great position - between the two biggest metros in NE.

[mod134]

Regarding Providence and the Dunkin' Donuts Center, I think an Arena Football or ALS Soccer franchise would work in Providece; The AFL is looking to have a team at the T.D. Banknorth Garden in Boston. With that in mind, I don't see them coming to Providence. A reasonable alternative may be AFL2. Think of it as the AHL-NHL thing only its AFL2 and AFL. The Verizon Wireless Arena in Manchester, NH has an AFL2 team called the Manchester Wolves and the AHL Manchester Monarchs.

I think the AFL2 team may be a good option for the city if Boston ends up getting a franchise; I believe that it would complement its two existing tenants - the P-Briuns AHL team and the PC Friars.

While Foxboro is not far from Providence, an MLS franchise would be nice. A 20k-30k seat stadium could have a dual-purpose. As a new and state-of-the-art venue, it would spotlight and promote the city with an outlet for its soccer fans rather than the overwhelming 70k seat Gillette Stadium where 18,000 fans look on (a previous poster made this good point, sorry I forgot your name.) The other possiblity is larger concerts like Gillette does now. It certainly would help the city and appease concert-goers by offering a larger venue for the favorite performers. The stadium would hold at least, if not more, (depending on the final seating capacity) of the 15-20k seat arenas in Hartford and Boston.

I can't wait for the renovations to be completed! I've been to a lot of concerts, and P-Bruins games over the years.

[brick]

This thread is interesting, thought I would add $0.02

I love the idea of moving the Revs to Providence. The major hurdle here is that Bob Kraft owns the Revs so why should he move them to another stadium? I'm sure he'd do it if Providence gave him a really sweet deal, but I don't think that would be prudent for the city.

Regarding the PawSox. Again there is a money issue here. Mondor and the PawSox basically own McCoy. I don't even recall if they needed financing to make the renovations a few years ago. Building a new stadium for the PawSox seems like a waste as it would require debt service for the team...or, again, a substantial subsidy from the city.

I think the Boston metro could support two MLB teams. The ticket prices at Fenway combined with the sellout streak are enough evidence of that. The question is whether the second team could succeed being located in Providence. I'm not sure there is enough population close. I also think there are several MSAs larger than Providence which would be "on the list" for an MLB franchise before a second Boston franchise. In fact, I think a third "New York" franchise (either in Bridgeport/Stamford or in Northern NJ) would be ahead of a second New England one.

I also don't know about anyone else, but I was sad that the X and Gravity games both moved on from Providence. I had a good time at those.

[Griswald]

Agreed on the X-Games. The start line for street luge and in-line skating was at the top of the street I grew up on, I had a lot of fun watching that. It was definitely great for Providence even though the games arent on the level of pro sports.

I would love to see a smaller (20-30 thousand) stadium in Providence, for soccer, concerts and whatever else. Gillette is overwhelming for an MLS game. Also I wonder if one of the college teams could use the stadium as well (Brown has always had a good program, and their stadium is tiny), kindof like the Civic Center shares duties.

I think one of the more obscure sports would be great for Providence though, since the city has always had that alternative/artsy/creative persona. Arena football would be great, or roller hockey, indoor lacrosse....something along those lines, but it would have to be multi-purpose i.e. cater to more than one sport or use.

[Mij]

I remember a while back that a post (could have been my own post) had taled about the fact that the Krafts have been quitly shopping for a 20k - 30 stadium deal with in the Demographic area of the soccer's main audiance. A couple of areas that came up where Providence/Cranston, Fall River, New Bedford, and of course Boston. I would like the Revs to here in Providence being a fan of the game.

What i would really like is for Providence College to have a varsity football program in Division 1. The Big East being a great conference for football would be perfect. The Friars have long been our major sports program. In all reality this wil not happen for many reasons, PC is a small school - football is very exspensive....

What we can do to get our own pro sports Francise is create The MLR (Major league Rugby). It screams providence. Alternative sport, lots of drinking, and of course barbarianesque cultural appeal.

[brick]

I remember a while back that a post (could have been my own post) had taled about the fact that the Krafts have been quitly shopping for a 20k - 30 stadium deal with in the Demographic area of the soccer's main audiance. A couple of areas that came up where Providence/Cranston, Fall River, New Bedford, and of course Boston. I would like the Revs to here in Providence being a fan of the game.

If Kraft really is looking for a 20K place for the Revs, then I think it would behoove PVD to put something together. Knock down the 903 and put it there . OK, really, I'm sure there are some brownfields off of Allens Ave where this could go. The problem is that Kraft basically tried to hold Boston over a barrel when he wanted to move the Pats to Southie, and I'm sure he would do the same in any other stadium deal. Kraft is not a generous man. A smart one, yes, but not generous. My guess it that the city/state would foot the bill for this. And, while I love sports, I don't think they are the economic engines for the public that people claim they are. I'm not sure I could honestly support a bond issue to pay for a stadium just to let Kraft make more money.

If he would build the stadium if the city provided land and infrastructure support, that might be more palatable, especially if they can get a brownfields grant and recover some crappy land. I would definitely go to a few games if they were in PVD.

Too bad there is not really a lot being talked about, but PVD does have bigger problems.

[mr2448]

I totally forgot about that part of the city (probably because it is totally forgetable), I'm sure a chunk of land big enough for a stadium could be cobbled together from the half empty strip malls along North Main Street or Charles Street or anywhere in between, along Branch Ave.

Did I miss something? Noone has even mentioned the coming of professional Polo in Providence! A soccer stadium can also double as a Polo field.

Seriously, I doubt any major league expansion can take place in Providence except for Arena Football, which was here in the initial year of the league, or indoor soccer. There is already a Division 2(?) soccer team in East Providence and it use to be Division 1. A WNBA team could not make it here. The Mohegan Franchise use to be in Hartford.

Mark

[uconn99]

The WNBA was never in Hartford. The Connecticut sun were once the Orlando Miracle. Hartford did have a pro womans team called the New England Blizzard. I believe the league was the ABA? It was basically before the WNBA got big but it only lasted a few years.

Also, in regards to PC getting D-1 football. Wasn't PC the school that cut many sports from its budget? It would be nice to have more D-1A football teams in New England since BC and UConn are the only ones out there. I could see a school like New Hamshire which has had good success over the years or possibly Maine going D-1A if they got support from the state like UConn has. UMass would probably be the most likley school to go 1A however.

[Frankie811]

Wasn't PC the school that cut many sports from its budget?

They cut men's baseball because they would have had to offer womens baseball as well, under Title IX, a federal law that prohibits discrimination in all aspects of education, including sports. . They could not afford to do it.

[Garris]

If he would build the stadium if the city provided land and infrastructure support, that might be more palatable, especially if they can get a brownfields grant and recover some crappy land.

Too bad there is not really a lot being talked about, but PVD does have bigger problems.

You hit all the key issues Brick. I don't think anyone in Prov or RI would support any significant public spending at all on any stadium of any type unless it were part of a larger brownfields kind of thing. I'd certainly vote against it otherwise... PVD does have higher priority issues.

Hey, UCONN99, how did the Huskies do in football this year? I know they're trying to become a top-draw football school to complement their basketball power. I remember them making good progress the year before...

Here's a question for everyone. My parents and I were at the recent Brown-Albany basketball game (my parents are both SUNY Albany alums, and I have my Brown fellowship, so it was a little intrafamilial bet and competition). My parents were asking about Providence sports teams and their names, and I started thinking...

If Providence were to have a pro team in any sport (from Polo to Soccer... Anything...), what would you name it?

The Providence __________

Ideas? Many of our local college team names (Bears, Friars, etc) do little for me...

- Garris

[HartfordTycoon]

You hit all the key issues Brick. I don't think anyone in Prov or RI would support any significant public spending at all on any stadium of any type unless it were part of a larger brownfields kind of thing. I'd certainly vote against it otherwise... PVD does have higher priority issues.

Hey, UCONN99, how did the Huskies do in football this year? I know they're trying to become a top-draw football school to complement their basketball power. I remember them making good progress the year before...

Here's a question for everyone. My parents and I were at the recent Brown-Albany basketball game (my parents are both SUNY Albany alums, and I have my Brown fellowship, so it was a little intrafamilial bet and competition). My parents were asking about Providence sports teams and their names, and I started thinking...

If Providence were to have a pro team in any sport (from Polo to Soccer... Anything...), what would you name it?

The Providence __________

Ideas? Many of our local college team names (Bears, Friars, etc) do little for me...

- Garris

The Football season was not great but not a total wash. We missed out on bowl eligibility by 1 game I think. We won the Motor City Bowl in Detroit last year, our first ever bowl appearance. Look for good things in the future. All games did sell out in the 40,000 seat Rentschler Field though.

Men's Basketball is doing great this season, if you don't follow already. We are #2 and should be #1 and both the men's and women's teams won their respective pre-season tournaments.

And if you guys haven't heard yet, they are talking about the NHL again in Hartford. Northland, the Mass based developer of Hartford 21, has said they are comitted to purchasing an NHL team and building a New Arena Downtown, the Civic Center would then be demolished to make way for another tower and a Rockefeller Center type of plaza. We got some big players lining up on this one and dozens of struggling sun-belt teams. Wish us luck, we are going down the Major League road again, hopefully.

[brick]

The Providence __________

Plantations?

[Frankie811]

Plantations?

The Providence Whatcheers! The Providence buddies hehehehehe

[Frankie811]

And if you guys haven't heard yet, they are talking about the NHL again in Hartford.

Is this a wise decision? It's already been proving that Hartford can't support an NHL team, let alone an AHL team. The HCC only draws about 4,000+ for an AHL hockey game. Why would an invester bring a NHL team to a second tear city where the best they could hope for is 13,000 a game? What was the average attendance for the previous Hartford Wailers?

[HartfordTycoon]

Is this a wise decision? It's already been proving that Hartford can't support an NHL team, let alone an AHL team. The HCC only draws about 4,000+ for an AHL hockey game. Why would an invester bring a NHL team to a second tear city where the best they could hope for is 13,000 a game? What was the average attendance for the previous Hartford Wailers?

Hey, I'm not the one with a $1.4 billion portfolio who thinks it's a good idea. They must have done the research. I don't know exact figures, but even as one of the worst teams, the Whalers had some of the best attendance in the league. It's a misconception that our team was not supported. They just sucked. They only left because at the time CT would not provide public subsidy for a new arena. I bet we don't make that mistake again. That decision set us back about a decade.

[Garris]

They must have done the research. I don't know exact figures, but even as one of the worst teams, the Whalers had some of the best attendance in the league. It's a misconception that our team was not supported. They just sucked.

I actually, believe it or not, think HartfordTycoon is right. I grew up in the Hardford sphere of influence and remember that the Whalers were actually well supported locally. The probably was that they profoundly sucked, the Civic Center sucked, and no one at that time (at least where I lived) wanted to drive into Hartford. And you can't compare the draw of minor league sports to a major league sport.

These days, what matters more than pure game attendance is how robust is the local business community to buy seats and luxury boxes. That is where they make their money. In this respect, Hartford, despite its lower population, has a better chance than a city like Providence to draw a major league club. Also, Western CT is a huge hockey area on the high school level.

With UConn basketball and football moving to the downtown-ish area in the future, and with the sports momentum that generates, and given there is absolutely nothing else sports-wise in the entire region, I think a new Whalers team would have a good good shot!

- Garris

[Frankie811]

They only left because at the time CT would not provide public subsidy for a new arena.

What was so wrong with the HCC? Why did they need a new arena?

[HartfordTycoon]

What was so wrong with the HCC? Why did they need a new arena?

There's a big difference between need and want. I know for a fact that they made more money up here then they make in NC. But NC built them what they wanted and they left. I mean I don't fool myself into thinking Hartford is high on the national priority list, but c'mon they should have never left. It was a foolish business move and I think alot of people here and there are still kicking themselves.

[uconn99]

The Whalers were very well supported and it shows in the year by year attendance figures. I just pulled up some attendance numbers for the 18 year history of the "Hartford Whalers" and the average yearly attendance was just under 13,000. Not bad considering the team had 16 losing seasons and the hockey capacity was around 15,500. Also believe it or not those attendance figures didn't include the 100's of luxury box seats. The whalers owner didn't want to include those numbers into attendance figures for whatever reason. To make a long story short, the state got screwed over by the owner who was boys with the corupt governor weiker, but thats a whole other story and since this is a pvd board I will not go into that.

Edit-

The first few years in Carolina the team didn't crack 10,000 fans most the season. There was a article in Sports Illustrated about this. Now with a better team down there, a team that made the finals a few seasons ago they still don't sell out.