Low Blow by the Brits?

[satalac]

Davis Street in Jacksonville sprawls for miles. I'm not talking about a block. A person who does not live in the neighborhood cannot walk through the area in broad daylight. Trust me, I've seen it with my own eyes.

Emerson Arms is not one block either. It is a large area, and even the cops admit it's deadly. When the car dealer in Miami said do not drive through that neighborhood, he meant it. There was no joking about it. I believe it, because I have seen similar things in Jacksonville.

Gun battles in Russia/Georgia/Kosovo/Belfast etc are because of socio-political reasons. Gun terror in the States is because of depravity. Depravity of that extreme is commonplace these days, and is not indicative of a great country. The States isn't even in the top ten of great countries.

[monsoon]

the trend shows that these things happen, but then we always bounce back. you have to come to the realization that the economy is much different than what it was when you were growing up. and yes, i am talking globally. will it happen more frequently? possibly. but i doubt that one as big as the great depression with hit again in our lifetime.

could you provide some background on this?

i believe that we both agree that something must be done to help us get back on top of the world stage, but the truth is, we're not falling behind, everybody is catching up. we have our ups and downs, it's just that when we have our downs, less people feel it globally now (especially with china and india becoming massive global markets). btw, i think that we have begun to get off topic. maybe we should start a new thread about this?

[Charlotteman]

.... but is that really how you define the united states? by it's gun problems?

[satalac]

First you ignored your own evidence that supports my argument. (BTW, the Great Depression started 80 years ago) Then when I mentioned the living standards of Japan and Western Europe you drag in India and China which has nothing to do with this. Furthermore you also dismiss everything else that people have said to you on the matter. So I am of the conclusion that you are not really wishing to discuss this and instead continue to tell us "America is Best, America is Best" in hopes I would assume that if it is said enough times, people will believe it. I think you just proved the whole crux of the problem here.

Do you not think that I know the economy is different now than when I was growing up? That really has nothing to do with proving or disproving that Americans are worse off now, bit is is a distraction. And what trend shows that we always bounce back? The Great Depression happened more than a lifetime ago. Where are the trends that show that crime, poverty, lack of education, loss of jobs, loss of household income, is getting better? They are not.

As far as providing links, I don't plan to do that as I assume you are bright enough to use google if you really wanted proof of what I said but again, I don't think you do.

[satalac]

I think the discussion here has strayed a little from the British TV show to what's good or bad about America. If you go back and read my earlier post, you'll see that I list gun terror as only one reason why I do not think the States is a great country.

I also mentioned millions of Americans having no health insurance, the fact that our constitutional rights have been trampled on (based on a lie) and the fact that our country is committing torture.

Want more? How about the fact that my civil rights as an American are routinely put up to public vote-i.e. when same sex marriage goes up to public vote. What about the millions of Americans wasting away in prison, there for marijuana? What about the old people in the country that can't buy medicine, since they don't get enough Social Security?

Do you really think these things spell out the characteristics of a great country?

[Charlotteman]

^^Satalac this isn't easy being the lone voice of dissent here. I, for one, appreciate your posts and am glad you are participating in this thread, even though we disagree on many things.

I am in my 50s and cynicism has crept into my old brain-lol I'm very cynical about our country, because I have seen it degrade since the 1980s, and any improvement seems far far in the distance.

I grew up in the 1960s when there really was hope in the country. Alas that hope has drifted into the world of greed. These days, money and gun ownership seem to be the goals of most Americans.

Sorry to keep targeting Jacksonville, but it's a city I am very familiar with. I just googled Jacksonville crime, and an article pulled up saying gun sales in Jax are up 20% from last year. Things are so out of control that normal citizens are feeling the urgency to pack heat.

Again, this whole thing isn't all about crime and guns. It's about the decline of America. Lots of decline in lots of areas.

[erdogs]

^^^ That's what I like about you Charlotteman, you're always respectful of other people's views. I think we can all agree that America has some serious internal problems and to be honest I don't have all the answers to solve them. I still have hope that we can somehow find real solutions and not just put band aids on the problems. I still believe this is a great country and most of the people I have come across in my short 35 years have been good, honest citizens just trying to make a living. It's like they say, it's always the few bad apples that ruin the bunch or something like that. I just don't think guns are the problem, it's people's attitudes toward violence and making a cheap buck that needs to change. Guns are just the tool, just as a knife or shank is the tool in the UK. Good people don't use these tools for violence.

[satalac]

^^Satalac this isn't easy being the lone voice of dissent here. I, for one, appreciate your posts and am glad you are participating in this thread, even though we disagree on many things.

I am in my 50s and cynicism has crept into my old brain-lol I'm very cynical about our country, because I have seen it degrade since the 1980s, and any improvement seems far far in the distance.

I grew up in the 1960s when there really was hope in the country. Alas that hope has drifted into the world of greed. These days, money and gun ownership seem to be the goals of most Americans.

Sorry to keep targeting Jacksonville, but it's a city I am very familiar with. I just googled Jacksonville crime, and an article pulled up saying gun sales in Jax are up 20% from last year. Things are so out of control that normal citizens are feeling the urgency to pack heat.

Again, this whole thing isn't all about crime and guns. It's about the decline of America. Lots of decline in lots of areas.

[monsoon]

how did i ignore it? you mean the great depression of 1929? that would be it wouldn't it? the india and china issue was not in context to the japan and western europe living standards. it was showing how the global market is shifting towards these countries with massive populations that are now gaining a middle class. while western europe and japan are great places, they have their share of problems as well. i am not dismissing everything that anyone has said on here. i am discussing this, yet you choose to blow it off as otherwise. am i saying that america is best? no, show me where i said that. i admitted that we have problems. yet you have yet to address my original statement that we would rather beat ourselves up than take pride in our country and actually do something about the problems.

i am aware that you have seen the economy go through many phases. does that mean that i know nothing about it because you are my elder? my point on the economy being different is that we aren't the only super power anymore. that's why all of this seems so foreign to us.

are the trends growing upward? i know where to find this information, but where are you getting YOUR research from. that's the question i asked. instead of painting me as a person who cares little what other's say, i am actually asking for where you get your research from. i would like to know. not to prove a point, but for actual knowledge. that is the point of discussion right?

[satalac]

i believe that we are both too set in our views monsoon to continue with a constructive discussion. i am going to respectfully leave this discussion in the best interests of the forum.

[monsoon]

i believe that we are both too set in our views monsoon to continue with a constructive discussion. i am going to respectfully leave this discussion in the best interests of the forum.

[Southron]

And after having clicked on the Wikipedia link above, I see that the show has already received numerous criticisms for promoting anti-gay stereotypes and specifically for staging controversial events and editing them to look real. What a shock.