Peyton to push smaller courthouse option

[bobliocatt]

Mayor Peyton will recommend the construction of a new 388,000sf Duval County Courthouse and keeping some court functions at the existing courthouse, to the city council. Limited renovations would be done on the existing Bay Street courthouse, which will house civil court functions. The plan also includes renovations of the old federal courthouse and the Ed Ball building, which would house the State Attorney's Office and the Public Defender's Office.

http://www.bizjournals.com/jacksonville/st...tml?jst=b_ln_hl

[RiversideGator]

Ahh, the incompetence keeps on coming. Correct me if I am wrong, but wasnt this the Option which was least favored by the committee?? In fact, I thought they outright said that this option was out of the question. I think we need to take a wait till we get a real mayor approach to this problem.

[JaxNole]

I didn't vote for this, but I'm getting it, so since I didn't vote for Peyton, can I vote him out?

[bobliocatt]

This plan will cost the taxpayers a lot more money in the long run, because construction prices will continue to go up and we'll waste a couple million renovating the old building. Getting off the waterfront and having an RFP for the land, would add millions of dollars that could be used for a larger new courthouse. After all, JEA just earned $40.6 million for a polluted brownfield site.

Although the courthouse land is smaller, it would probably go for the same price or more, given its centralized location on the Northbank. Riverside, you're right, this thing needs to be delayed until a new Mayor is elected.

[Viper]

*shaking my head*

He doesn't get it, does he? Save now, waste more later approach is horrible.

Get it off the river Peyton. Use that land as a balance to the higher cost of a bigger, centralized courthouse.

I can already see the courthouse as being a platform by which those running for mayor will stand on.

[scongro]

I guess this really kills the Bay St. Town Center project.

You know, this really isn't good for downtown (Stating what is obvious to everyone but Midget Mayor). The whole point to the consilidated judicial complex was to genreate a district that encourages law offices, Starbucks, Panera, etc, while on Bay St, you have more dinner type places, nightclubs, bars, retail, etc.

I will be contacting my council representative, since it appears that they have final say in this one (I may call the 5 at-large as well), on this one.

[BosTech]

Peyton should be VOTED out of office,hes messing up whole downtown (Northbank) area with his horibble ideas and approaches.

Waste money and time is all hes doing...but he does makes sure that he turns profit in his personal life and to build nice 2.5 mil house.

Peyton needs to get out of mayors office and do not touch courthouse untill real man takes charge of project.

[Southron]

What a retard. I was in Jax late last year and checked out the area scongro is talking about. Jacksonville has too much potential to be saddled with a visionless mayor like this guy.

[scongro]

I truly believe if we get the City Hall Annex and Courthouse off the river, Jacksonville could have a great corridor for entertainment. Idealy, I'd live to see Bay St. as the entertainment corridor, Adams St. the Dining Corridor, and Laura St as the thread connecting it all. However, the Big Guys & the Politicians need to lay the groundwork for the little guys (eclate, Circa 46, etc.) to succeed.

The man just doesn't get it. I've vented countless times on why Peyton needs to not be reelected.

Here's an interesting thought - check out the new poll....

[BosTech]

Guy is an idiot,but I still think hes got hidden agenda to destroy or delay just about every project on Northbank.

City like Jax where 1.2 milion people live and with all money city has is not able to create ONE single entertainment street is beyond me I know cities 10 times smaller then Jax that have better night life.

Unresloved isssue with courthouse will cause problems to half of projects on Northbank and considerign that even if they start project today it will be finished earliest 2010,so eveyrthing else on Northbank would be delayed all this time excluding few projects like Carling.

[jjoshjl]

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

So, let me get this strait....

we are going to build a courthouse that doesnt even fit our current needs... and then they are going to continue to use the old courthouse to supplument it.

So.. Hold on.. We are now tieing up 2 areas.. one of which is river front property... And to top it off, in 10 years, we are going to be right back where we started on this and need a NEW new courthouse...

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

Jez, who writes this stuff... I feel like im on a bad soap or something ..Peyton Hospital....

Wow...

STUPIDITY....

[Viper]

Guys, time to flood with letters. Congressmen, FTU, Jax.com, etc...

I smell something in Jax and for once, it isn't pulp, beer or coffee.

[afh]

Someone made a good point earlier about this saving money now approach will cost the city more at a later date. Peyton does care that it'll cost the city more in the long run. B/c as every good politican worth his or her salt thinks, any potential problems for a city, county, state or feds that would occur after his/her watch is not their problem. As long as things are okay during their current tenure it's all good.

[RideBikes]

I am not surprised at the Mayor's plan. He does not have the courage to do the right thing now. Why did he spend 9 months of time getting to this and wasting the time of the advisory committee if he was not going to listen to them?

The Cannon Design courthouse foundation drawings were complete and most of the other construction drawings were almost complete, so the building could have been coming out of the ground by now. At this point in time, procuring design services for his current bad idea will take some time, building consensus on the program and design will take at least a year, and then the construction documents can begin. (there is also no guarantee that the construction bids will come in on his budget, even with his contingency included) I do not anticipate seeing construction for another 2 years.

[JaxNole]

So Mayor Peyton is now using the same argument of increasing costs for and against any progress of the courthouse. I thought he was a businessman. Maybe he needs a refresher class on finance and time value of money, because he seems to have forgotten current money values are worth more than future values. I'd like to see a cost analysis once this is over to see how much all this waiting has cost us. I didn't vote for the BJP just to have an expensive lot close to I-95!

[RiversideGator]

I thought he was a businessman. Maybe he needs a refresher class on finance and time value of money, because he seems to have forgotten current money values are worth more than future values.

I think the City should also factor into its decision the fact that the lot where the current courthouse is would sell for at least $20-40 million dollars (after seeing the bids on the Haydon Burns site and the old JEA site) and putting more cash into that moneypit on Bay Street is like throwing good money after bad. This building is functionally obsolete in so many ways and needs massive renovations to last 20 years. And, why not sell some bonds to finance this like a mortgage and use the revenue for the $15 ticket surcharge (which is a tax hike and is already in place by the way) to partially fund this. They need to do some creative financing and do the whole thing at once. We have an expanding tax base here and more money will be coming in each year. Think big, not small.

[bobliocatt]

FTU Editorial endorsing the Courthouse Plan

COURTHOUSE: Finding a way

Nobody is overjoyed with Mayor John Peyton's plan for a Duval County Courthouse, not even Peyton himself. But, under the circumstances, it seems to be the best possible alternative.

Peyton announced this week that he wanted to spend about $190 million for a 388,000-square-foot criminal courts building in LaVilla. Offices of the state attorney would be moved into the old federal courthouse, and the public defender would go into the Ed Ball Building.

Civil courts would remain in the old county courthouse until there is money to expand the new building. That second phase, it has been estimated, would cost between $79 million and $134 million.

It isn't ideal to split the courts into two buildings, several blocks apart. However, the city doesn't have enough money to build a bigger courthouse.

When they approved the bond issue, voters were promised a combined courthouse for about $190 million.

Since then, the purchase of land has added to the cost. The price of construction materials escalated rapidly. Security requirements are far more stringent -- and expensive -- as a result of the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks.

A courthouse no longer can be built for the price originally envisioned -- and the city doesn't have enough money to make up the difference.

The voters were promised a courthouse, and that is what they will get. It just won't be as big as originally expected, if Peyton gets his way. That isn't ideal, but what is the alternative? A very large tax increase? Cuts in police and fire protection or other vital services? Less road construction? Fewer parks?

This city needs a functional courthouse, not an elaborate one. As long as the criminal building fits that description, there probably won't be a lot of public resistance to expanding it for the civil courts once money is available.

http://www.jacksonville.com/tu-online/stor..._19302880.shtml

[jjoshjl]

^ the guy is right about one thing...

Most people will be content with this...

They arent going to care one way or the other what it will look like or even the fact that it doesnt totaly suit our needs. All they will care about is they get a new shiny ourthouse. Even if it is sub-par

[Captain Obvious]

I'm unclear on whether the courthouse will have a new design or not??

Because if the design is unchanged, where will they have enough room to eventually build the civil courthouse?

[RideBikes]

I'm unclear on whether the courthouse will have a new design or not??

Because if the design is unchanged, where will they have enough room to eventually build the civil courthouse?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It will be a new design. The old design was a fully integrated civil and criminal courthouse. Functionally this allowed judges to utilize any courtroom during their rotation from civil to criminal.

The new plan will require duplication of Clerk operations, Court Administration operations and Sheriff's requirements.

There is no design yet, the mayor is basing his recommendation on programming studies and square footage costs.

[BosTech]

So let me guess,we gonna pay ANOTHR 60 mil to another design so we can duplicate everything and actually have to build even more at later date for lot more money??

Great plan Peyton.

What if Peyton married hooker and then at later date when he makes money buys her new clothes,cleans her up,few surgeries,dye in blonde as money permits???

This guy is disaster for Jacksonville,he is either having hidden agenda to do this or he doesnt have any clue about life.

But seems to me like he never bothered about courthouse all this time,like he made his desicion at last moment.

Considering that guys married nice blonde girl,own 4 houses,builds 2.5 milion new mansion,owns shares in profitable companies,makes 6 figures at either job I don't buy that he doesnt know what hes doing.

Either way,hope we get him out of office and vote someone that it can do good for Jacksonville not cause harm and self interest.

[Viper]

Does he not understand that the current land can be sold for $30+ million? Sell that and you have yoru money to cover the cost of the fully centralized courthouse.

Splitting it up and paying more in the long run is economically inane when a better idea is sitting on the banks of the St Johns river.

[Viper]

http://www.jacksonville.com/tu-online/stor..._19313289.shtml

I made the paper.

Don't let it stop with me.

[bobliocatt]

Good letter, short & sweet!