chris722
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Posts posted by chris722
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On 1/17/2019 at 6:20 PM, vdogg said:
This was on the January 7th design review docket. Renderings included in packet.
https://www.norfolk.gov/AgendaCenter/ViewFile/Item/4683?fileID=9374
I'm confused. I thought this was over with, so there's still hope?
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On 10/21/2019 at 9:59 AM, Young75 said:
People drive hours just to get the experience I think it will. This will be the first casino in Virginia.The city actually comes alive more now so the casino will add to the experience of being here. Not only Norfolk but the whole area. One casino isn’t gonna wave a magical wand solve everything. Cleveland and Detroit have economies different from Norfolk/HR. I can see the comparison but the rust belt cities are in a whole different circumstance and the state politics are very different. This area actually has a mild climate and a beach. The experience is just different IMO.
A CITY that is a suburb that is rural?? Is that the impression that this area gives?
Chesapeake? I guess yea but not Norfolk tho. Honestly Norfolk, Portsmouth, Newport News and Hampton are actually legit cities. Virginia Beach, Chesapeake and Suffolk are more like suburbs so you can still get the best of “all 3 worlds” lol Norfolk is only 54 sq miles let it be urban please.
People are excited about it. That effort to force a referendum failed, so it is what it is.
I agree that Norfolk, Portsmouth, Newport News, and Hampton are legit cities. People always want to compare Norfolk to Richmond and state that Richmond is more of a city than Norfolk. I can see the arguments both ways. I think that Norfolk is urban for this region, but maybe not so much for other regions, and definitely not by West Coast or East Coast standards. But I've been in plenty of Midwestern cities with density similar or less than Norfolk, and it is not a deal breaker for me.
You're right about Midwestern cities with casinos and how those economies are different. For one Cleveland and Detroit aren't defined by tourism. For another they're larger cities. Fair enough.
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Cool. Amazon has done this with a lot of the dead malls in Ohio would love to see this here.
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On 9/24/2019 at 10:26 AM, zeppelin14 said:
An interesting article from WAVY today which basically states all of our frustrations on all of these new cookie cutter apartments that are being plopped down with no imagination:
Review board members say initial building plans for new public housing look more ‘Virginia Beach’ than ‘Norfolk’So they're really going to redevelop that area. And not just study it for 15 years?
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A casino isn't going to do anything for Norfolk. Won't do anything for Portsmouth either. A lot of cities built casinos and they still suck. Did casinos help Cleveland or Detroit? In any meaningful way; I understand those cities have little gentrification action going on but did the casinos make any meaningful impact on their urban areas?
On 10/18/2019 at 2:09 AM, Young75 said:The city needs to use some big city style politics and just build it. Forget them. This area will study you to death and still not do anything lol These people should not be allowed to stop progress. I feel like these are the same people that think single family suburban neighborhoods (Ghent Square and whatever that area is through Llewellyn) is acceptable in downtown. (I do like the trees tho) It’s NOT. These people have suburban mindsets in a place that calls itself the URBAN CORE. Please MOVE OUT OF NORFOLK if you don’t want to be in a CITY. I was reading a review at an apartment building in downtown Norfolk. They complained about noise outside.....why would you move to downtown then? I’m praying that they fail one way or the other in the end lol
Move out of Norfolk if you don't want to be in a city? This is Hampton Roads, having a city that is a suburb that is rural is the entire point of being here I thought you already knew?
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Still no progress just an empty lot at this point.
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On 12/14/2017 at 9:34 PM, BFG said:
It's across from the old now-closed 7-11. The article mentioned wanting to offer views of the Hague. If we're considering that downtown (I know that varies depending on who you ask), I say go for something as tall as Hague Towers, if not taller...downtown needs height!
Interesting. I did not know that was up for sale, nor that it had been purchased. Should be interesting.
What about the flooding down there? That entire area needs to be raised. Maybe we'll get a new parking garage out of the deal.
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On 5/4/2017 at 9:33 PM, urbanlife said:
Norfolk should merge with Suffolk, for obvious reasons.
Interesting. First time I've ever heard this suggested. What are the obvious reasons?
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On 2/21/2006 at 9:39 PM, urbanvb said:
Chesapeake council will decide fate of narrow homes
Developers are buying the old homes in South Norfolk, Indian River and
some sections of Deep Creek, made out of several adjoining lots, tearing
them down and replacing one house with two, three or four tall, narrow houses.
anyone else think these houses are hideous ?
That reminds me of something one would see in Queens or the Bronx.
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Norfolk and Portsmouth are essentially the same city. I often wonder about Newport News and Hampton, but I'm not familiar enough with the Peninsula to make that suggestion.
I don't see Virginia Beach or Chesapeake merging with anyone else. Technically Virginia Beach is at a point where it does not need to; already the largest city in Virginia by population and, has the potential to be the largest county by population as well if it were to move in a more progressive direction and stop being so suburban. Nothing for Virginia Beach to gain; yes, one could have a larger city if it were to merge with Norfolk but these are residents who, historically, wanted a suburban life outside of Norfolk to begin with so I don't see them going back to that, even if it is name only. It's like a Toronto vs Vancouver thing.
With both cities, the Achilles heel is the Southside. No one wants to see South Virginia Beach or South Chesapeake developed. I'm not so sure that either necessarily needs to be developed into their Northern counterpart but I don't see that changing in either city in our lifetimes.
And Williamsburg is never going to merge. You would have an easier time making a city out of James CIty County, puling a "Virginia Beach" and call that Williamsburg than you would getting it to merge with anything else on the Peninsula.
There's nothing wrong with Hampton Roads. No different than New England the region just needs a defining city like they have Boston. One of the reasons why people don't know what Hampton Roads, or the Mid-Atlantic, for example, is because there are no real defining things about it. Like people throw DC and Baltimore into the North; apologists say Mid-Atlantic, it is a backhanded way of defining Northern Virginia but then that same crowd does not want into include Hampton Roads in that dynamic. It is maddening. So Mid-Atlantic will never take off for that reason. Some people in DC/Baltimore want to be in the Mid-Atlantic and some people in DC/Baltimore want to be up North. So go figure.
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On 12/5/2017 at 7:26 PM, HRVT said:
I agree that merging all of Hampton Roads would be essentially impossible. If I could redraw boundaries, I would do the following (yes, I'm aware that this would never happen for a number of reasons)....
1. Peninsula: Hampton, Newport News, Poquoson, and York County merge into one city.
2. Western Hampton Roads: Take Chesapeake west of the Elizabeth River (ie: Western Branch, Deep Creek, Great Bridge) and combine it with Harborview and Eastern Suffolk.
3. Norfolk: Combine Norfolk and Portsmouth along with Chesapeake's South Norfolk and even small portions of western VB.
4. Virginia Beach: Take what's left of VB down to the "green line" and combine it with Greenbrier.
5. South Hampton Roads County: Take the southern half or so of VB (south of the "green line") along with the Hickory area (and south) in Chesapeake and what's left of Suffolk and combine it into a large county.
Any of those 5 scenarios work for me, as any of them would result in a larger city, thus more tax revenue due to a higher population, and maybe something could get done around here.
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On 8/27/2017 at 2:51 PM, BFG said:
It's been discussed numerous times up here and around town, but it's something that crosses my mind a lot. Every time Norfolk does something, VB announces plans to do something similar, and vice versa. Could a true merger between those two cities (or Norfolk and Chesapeake) really work, or is it a complicated disaster waiting to happen?
IMO, on paper, it's a great idea, and probably the most feasible one. You have people who live in VB, but work/play in Norfolk, and vice versa. But because the LRT expansion was shot down, someone who lives in Kempsville (in the case of Chesapeake, let's say Greenbrier) still has to drive to the base in Norfolk and sit in traffic. And that's not changing anytime soon. Creating one city could possibly change that. For building the economy and bringing more tourist and federal money to the region, it makes a ton of sense. It would probably become a lot easier to bring jobs here, knowing you could bring something to an area of 700K (500K with Chesapeake). I think we get more transportation dollars knowing we now have a city of 700K. I also think moving City Hall to Town Center becomes inevitable, as it probably becomes the central-most part of this larger city.
However, I think this deal potentially hurts VB/Chesapeake. Both have a lower property tax than Norfolk, excellent schools and a much lower crime rate. I'm sure they don't want to have to prop Norfolk up in those areas, and that's understandable. Also, what do you do with your councils? I highly doubt you'll see a combined 20-person council, but the areas are so spread out, I don't know if 11 members would adequately represent either. Would Mayor Alexander or Mayor Sessoms give up their positions, or still retain a title overseeing the respective "districts" of Norfolk and VB? I believe the boroughs of NYC have borough presidents; maybe something like that? Maybe allow the current council members to still represent their wards, but still elect a new 11-person council?
This is all just speculation; obviously it would need to be fleshed out over a number of years, but I'd love to see a true feasibility study outlining pros and cons and eliminating this back and forth we keep seeing, most recently with the two arenas. Could a merger work, or could parts of either city become part of Norfolk (i.e. South Norfolk now becomes part of Berkley, or the Bayside/Newtown Road area become part of Norfolk)?
Days of annexation are far behind us. All standing cities annexed what they could, and it is what it is.
I am told that a merger would have to happen at the state level. Sort of how New York City came about. I am all for merging cities on the Southside, and another merger among cities on the Peninsula. I am not for merging all seven cities of Hampton Roads. I think that to do so is untenable and entirely too much. The Peninsula has it's own personality, and the Southside has another. I see no real benefit in bringing the two together.
I doubt that Chesapeake would merge with anyone. Chesapeake is where people that do not want to be bothered with the experiment that is Hampton Roads go. Especially Southern Chesapeake. I could see Virginia Beach and Norfolk merging. Culturally, a merger, at the very least, of some of the more affluent areas of Chesapeake and Virginia Beach, all of which are conterminous anyway, makes sense. Let Norfolk pick up the scraps, reclaim areas like South Norfolk and those areas that border Virginia Beach. Norfolk could get up to around 300,000, maybe 350,000, best case scenario. Combined Virginia Beach and Chesapeake, or what is left of those areas, would easily reach 600,000 or more.
But the reality is that affluent areas, in the United States, simply are not as big as any combination of any of the counties or boroughs in Hampton Roads. What happened in the past, is that we created enormous cities, but the majority of the city was still poor. Look at New York City; Manhattan and Brooklyn, that makes a lot of sense. The other boroughs, not so much; even though those other boroughs have affluent neighborhoods if you were to look at it, I mean really look at it, Manhattan and Brooklyn were the only standing cities. The rest of that is just urbanized farmland.
That is the issue I have with merging all seven cities. All you're doing is making Suffolk or Chesapeake out to be the new Queens, or the new Bronx. Virginia Beach acquires even more wealth and becomes the Brooklyn of the area. Norfolk is the new Manhattan.
The best one can hope for is that Norfolk can reclaim South Norfolk. I don't think that Chesapeake really wants it anymore.
The elephant in the room is that no one wants Portsmouth. Norfolk and Portsmouth should merge. And Virginia Beach and Chesapeake should merge. I think that this is the least controversial option. And maybe Hampton and Newport News. Leave Suffolk and Williamsburg the way that they are. Hampton was a better situation but no more, after Newport News went about the business of dismantling their public housing. Same as what will happen when Norfolk dismantles theirs; whoever left Portsmouth public housing and went over to Norfolk will probably end up back in Portsmouth again. We already know that it is going to happen. Norfolk is only going to get another few thousand people into the city once they start building up where those housing projects exist. Plus they said that they were going to create lakes where the flooding is insufferable. This may create a shift towards Midtown, or Uptown, whatever, with the density, which I am all for but that also creates a situation where Norfolk becomes even less affordable than it is right now.
Mergers increase population, but they also amplify problems. This is one of the ways in which cities like Chicago and New York found themselves in the position that they are in (concerning disparities in wealth and poverty). The last thing we need is a mini Compton, East New York, or South Central, in Hampton Roads.
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On 9/11/2017 at 11:41 PM, BFG said:
Jobs. Most of the top 5 regions on that list (Austin, Raleigh, Nashville, Charlotte) have had job growth, and issue that has hurt us tremendously. We gotta stop relying on military so much and lure more jobs like ADP.
And I agree. One of the reasons why people so desperately wanted the second Amazon headquarters built here. Even though 50,000 workers is a drop in the bucket, it can disrupt the auxiliary situations in Hampton Roads and cause us to grow in ways that are not as easy to connect to the presence of Amazon's workers. But a distribution center would also be great. I like what Amazon did with that abandoned mall outside of the Cleveland metro.
On 12/1/2017 at 12:07 PM, BFG said:This would be our biggest hurdle. I think it would be a good start to regionalism, but how do you combine forces without losing something in the shuffle? I think one police force or school board is a sound idea, but with the latter, each city needs to get to a closer level. Right now, VB's schools are miles above Norfolk. Maybe in another five years? The article also said Nashville has a city-county government system, something I really wish we had here, but now will never happen. Perhaps that's what this area should've done in 1963: merge P.A. and Norfolk Counties to become one larger county, which then forms a city-county system with Norfolk.
Anyway, I hope the Chamber came away with some tips that will really help Hampton Roads grow. I actually do like it here, but after visiting Denver last week, I could see where we need improvement. If Norfolk and VB could work together, think outside the box, and take more chances, this area could thrive. Norfolk is starting to do that, but would VB be willing to work with them and not against (and vice versa)?
So far that has not happened. The outlet in Norfolk is a great example of how that does not happen here. Light rail is another. On the other hand, if Norfolk and Virginia Beach put up their money Virginia Beach could have scored that arena. Virginia Beach did not want to take that risk on by themselves, and so it did not happen. That is how things are done in Hampton Roads. One city goes out on a limb and all seven cities benefit. There is enough money around here for so many things, but not enough money in any one city to accomplish much of anything. Most people who vote, are "not in my backyard" and do not mind getting something for free without paying anything. A prime example of that is Chesapeake. It is what it is.
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Why doesn't Pittsburgh want an NBA team?Seattle is not ahead of us. Louisville would be competing with major college basketball teams within their state. Pittsburgh does not want the NBA. Vegas might be the only city ahead of us.
Sent from my Z831 using Tapatalk
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1 hour ago, carolinaboy said:
Yes, absolutely. The difference is astounding. Norfolk has made a lot of progress (and some mistakes) both on the public and private sides. In my opinion downtown Norfolk today is a very desirable place to live for those who want to live in an actual urban environment. 20 years ago downtown was OK to visit (Waterside, Admirals and Tides games, a few other things) but not really to live (for me anyway). Now........I would live there in a heartbeat.
Is Ghent a desirable urban environment? Seems like the Brooklyn of the area.
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12 hours ago, metalman said:
I just came back from NYC on Sunday and oh my God! Just amazing...old and new. And there are still probably two dozen buildings under construction.
Is block 9 topped out now?
I actually prefer NYC, because it is more the entire area, save Staten Island, whereas Chicago its pretty much downtown and that's it. Plus I think that Chicago is a confusing city to get around; lack of a grid like you have in NYC, and the trains are all overhead for the most part. Not to mention Chicago's flooding. All of that aside though I think Chicago is more stunning when it comes to architecture. People are a lot nicer, more laid back in Chicago as well. Definitely a different pace, more laid back energy in Chicago.
But if I had to choose one or the other for living, I would have to go with NYC, because Chicago just has too many problems with crime, taxes all over the place, infrastructure, etc. Chicago feels like a much larger version of your typical Midwestern city. I still felt like I was back in Ohio, just in a denser, more vertical, area. Not to mention the awful Midwestern weather where it can still get cold in the middle of the summer. Still glad I checked it out for what its worth.
Money goes further in Chicago but that is changing fast. If you're going to do it may as well go all out in NYC.
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12 hours ago, BFG said:
NFKjeff answered this, but I'll add that the opening of MacArthur Center in 1999 was what sparked the revitalization of downtown Norfolk. I was in high school at the time and lived in Chesapeake, so I can't answer too much, but I don't think you had the nightlife we see now, 20 years ago. From what I remember (and I could be wrong), there was Waterside, and not much else.
I haven't returned to Waterside since it reopened.
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3 hours ago, carolinaboy said:
Welcome.
I live in the surrounding region but not in Hampton Roads proper. Believe me, anywhere in Hampton Roads is more exciting than the general surrounding areas. I love the area because there is plenty to do even though sometimes it may not seem like it. When my wife and I are empty nesters I could very well end up in a downtown Norfolk apartment. That was hard to say twenty or thirty years ago.
Is Downtown Norfolk more desirable now than it was twenty years ago?
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6 hours ago, Norfolk757Kid said:
Norfolk and Portsmouth- put the two biggest ports under one city's jurisdiction, strengthen transit between the two and create a true urban core of Hampton Roads' longest inhabited spaces along the Elizabeth River. For obvious reasons, this will probably never happen, but with the Dillon Rule, the state, seeing the dysfunction currently in Portsmouth, could force the cities' hands and encourage a merger.
I don't see why this couldn't happen. Definitely would happen before a merger with Virginia Beach.
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On 11/24/2015 at 11:18 PM, 757Duke said:
Seeing stuff like this makes me bummed to be moving to Chicago, but I can't wait to explore all the architecture there.
Chicago is a beautiful city. But there aren't too many cities with that type of architecture though. Definitely not too many with that type of density, particularly in the Midwest.
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I'm originally from Akron, OH. I like to frequent development forums and anything interesting about Hampton Roads. That's pretty much it. No degree or anything. I've been here about 10 years. Love/hate relationship with the area, but I usually feel that way about every place I've lived/visited. Just, reasons, I guess.
This is a nice area though. Just not a very exciting one. Not sure that it really has to be though sometimes people that complain aren't that interesting themselves, so it is what it is.
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I'll take an additional light rail line within the next 15 years. I've learned not to ask for much.
I would also like to see 20 high rise residential developments in Norfolk before I die. I don't care if they're public/private partnerships or how it gets done, it is just something I would like to see.
Get rid of the housing projects downtown and give us a downtown to be proud of. No reason why we can't have what cities like Cleveland and Columbus take for granted. Enough people around here to make that sort of thing happen. I honestly don't care which city it is, I just assume it will be Norfolk, for obvious reasons. I just want a dense experience, like what you see up in DC. But without the height limits. Some people want NYC, especially over at City-Data, I don't need all of that but I would like a thick, unavoidable urban area, for those who want it, in Hampton Roads. Downtown Norfolk is the closest thing we have to that.
I'm also curious to see if Virginia Beach's 2040 plans will ever happen. Or even their 50 year plan. That looks really cool, like a neighborhood in Miami or something.
BFG mentioned a TRUE expansion of Town Center, to fill in all of the blight in Pembroke. Finally, someone knows what I'm talking about. Town Center should melt into the existing areas, not stand out like a sore thumb. Like downtown areas do in most cities. I think it will eventually happen, but the money probably isn't there yet. Virginia Beach's future plans do call for that but slowly, over a very long period of time. There is a reason why people aren't developing on the land. Town Center will probably expand all the way to WalMart on one side and perhaps either up to Green Run on the other side. They should start building over there where K Mart is instead of finding another tenant for that property. A nice mid rise complex. I'm doubtful that will happen but it is on my wish list.
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On 12/4/2015 at 2:51 AM, BFG said:
There's been more talk about the possibility of the Hampton Roads and Richmond markets merging to create a "megaregion". This is from a breakfast held yesterday...apparently, this idea is gaining traction.
http://hrscene.com/push-together-the-richmondhampton-roads-mega-region/
In 150 years. It will happen naturally as both areas expand out; reminds me of Northeastern Ohio, or Southwestern Ohio; it eventually happened on its own but there wasn't anything anyone could do on purpose to bring that about. And both areas are still challenged economically.
On 8/2/2017 at 1:33 PM, baobabs727 said:https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Metropolitan_Statistical_Areas
Pop. Growth 2010-2016:
Austin +19.82%
Raleigh +15.25%
Nashville +11.63%
Charlotte + 11.61%
Jacksonville +9.86%
Atlanta +9.5%
NOVA +8.8%
Richmond +6.09%
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VB/ORF +2.99%
This just continues the trends since the mid-1990s.
Any thoughts? Any plans? Any hope? Does it matter?
There just isn't any logical reason why Hampton Roads would experience 20% growth over a similar amount of time. We're lucky if we can maintain 2% growth year over year for the foreseeable future. I'll take 3 million by 2060. Conservative estimate.
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I don't think so. Norfolk and Virginia Beach do not have anything in common other than what you've already mentioned. The people are entirely different. The scene is entirely different. Norfolk aspires to be like other port cities, Portland, Seattle, Baltimore, etc Virginia Beach does not have anything in common with that aesthetic.
Virginia Beach and Chesapeake can attain Norfolk's population density, and I actually believe that they will surpass it over time, but the look and feel is something entirely different. Totally different energy out there than what you have in Norfolk.
As far as South Norfolk, it was its own city before Chesapeake was created out of a merger with that city and the county. They could have allowed Norfolk to annex. They didn't then, and I doubt that they would in the future, even though it is a better look for them than Chesapeake. I have always felt that Chesapeake patronizes South Norfolk, but they don't really care about it. That will always be the urban core of Chesapeake, even though the city will never recognize it as one.
I do agree with you about the San Francisco and Oakland comparison. That is Norfolk and Virginia Beach all day every day. Just leave well enough alone, and allow both cities to mature.
The real reason why people want the cities to merge is economic. If the seven cities could stand on their own, no one would care about a merger. But since each of the cities are, at best, a piece of the puzzle, there is closure with merging the cities together. Part of my issue with a merger is that you create an unhealthy dependence on the unit in order for the boroughs to thrive. Take New York City for example. The only other "city" you have out of all of those boroughs is Brooklyn. Brooklyn was its own city before the merger. Those other boroughs were rural counties that became urban over time, because of increasing rents in Manhattan.
People quickly forget that we have a similar situation here in Hampton Roads. Norfolk became undesirable, for a number of reasons; population density in Norfolk was a lot greater fifty years ago, the area represented the best and the worst of an urban experience in Virginia. So people left areas like Norfolk, Portsmouth, Newport News, and went into neighboring counties, filled out those areas, and new cities were formed. And that is the way that it will continue to be around here.
People just want Hampton Roads to become one city so they'll get their professional sports, or maybe Taylor Swift will come here for a change. I don't really think it is for a genuine concern for the area. The area is entirely too large, actually larger than New York, and it wouldn't create what people think it would. You'd end up with an experience more like Chicago or Los Angeles. Look at how those areas annexed over the years, and consolidated into a single city. Los Angeles is still accused of being suburban, despite evidence to the contrary. They do have an interesting entertainment industry, as a lot of professional sports teams, and they definitely have the concerts and other stuff that we would like to have here but they also have something that is hard to come by in this area; money. Money is why LA was able to build a great subway system in a rather short period of time. Money is why LA can afford to rebuild downtown in less than a decade, regardless of what type of earthquakes or natural catastrophes they have there. We don't have that type of money here. I'm not even sure if they have it like that in Northern Virginia.
Chicago is getting 52 new skyscrapers in an incredibly small amount of time. We have the population to support that type of development here, but we don't have the money to make that work. I'll be happy if we get light rail throughout Hampton Roads before I die. I'm thinking like, at least 10 lines that can take people where they need to go. And I keep my expectations low, not because of a lack of vision, or a lack of cooperation, but because the money just isn't here for those large projects to work. The people who could make it happen are going to vote against it, and the people that really want it are powerless to make it happen. But its better than Ohio, so I continue to stay here until I can position myself to go somewhere else.
You said it all with the lower property taxes in Virginia Beach and Chesapeake, which they can afford, for various reasons. Taxes would raise throughout Hampton Roads, people would cry foul, and everyone who could afford to do so would move to North Carolina.
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Chesapeake? I guess yea but not Norfolk tho. Honestly Norfolk, Portsmouth, Newport News and Hampton are actually legit cities. Virginia Beach, Chesapeake and Suffolk are more like suburbs so you can still get the best of “all 3 worlds” lol Norfolk is only 54 sq miles let it be urban please.
Meijer is coming to Northeast Ohio
in Cleveland
Posted
Took long enough. I think Dayton had Meijer like 15 years ago.