[Hampton Roads Off-Topic Talk]

That makes a good point... Americans love their backyards.  I don't think it's right to blame the city for somewhat suburban developments when it's American society that shapes these developments.  For many decades, a home in the burbs with a quarter acre was the dream and developers gave people what there was demand for.  The city can set zoning regulations, but it's silly to expect them to say "only mid-rise, multi-unit housing from now on" when developers are making a fortune with projects like East Beach.

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I wish I could provide a link for you to a really interesting article the Washington Post published recently. The title was something along the lines of, "The Suburbs Have Won."

It was thought-provoking for me because I'd always (probably foolishly) considered the suburbs a -- fairly -- uniquely American phenomenon. And although we may live that life in the extreme, compared to other nations, the article was saying that even fabled cities in Europe and Asian countries have been losing population. Besides the cost of housing in the cities, there was some of the same desire for a patch of ground to call one's own.

Of course, the article also mentioned the news that was reported so much several weeks ago: That a number of U.S. cities that had gained population in the '90s and sparked talk of a new urbanism were once again losing population.

I'm glad that Norfolk thus far seems to be bucking the rebuff of urban living, but maybe it shouldn't be too surprising since the residents of this area, until the last several years, had no true opportunity for downtown living, and certainly nothing as high-style as Granby Tower.

Great signature line, by the way.

[Hampton Roads Off-Topic Talk]

I don't see the market slowing down but what I don't understand is why is Norfolk building some suburban developments but pushing some urban developments. I think Norfolk should stick with strictly Urban development to change the city in the right direction. I think there should be 5-10 story condos and apt. all around the city and not just DT or somemore Townhouses or row housing. We are a city not a suburbs.

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Granby Tower and projects like it are steps in the right direction.

Interestingly, the Norfolk Preservation Alliance recently sponsored a speaker who's written a well-regarded book on urbanism. His criticism of Norfolk was what you cited: Suburban development in an urban area. I didn't recognize the slide he showed when he said that, but I think it was one of the newer mixed-income neighborhoods.

His point is that a city has to be a certain density to be self-sustaining, and that the density in that newly-rebuilt neighborhood (single-family homes) was just too low to be appropriate.

[Hampton Roads Off-Topic Talk]

Well if you remember Fraim did say that there are more buildings in the works with potential developers so maybe its possible. Norfolk is very behind in what it should  be for as old and its size and this regions size.

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Okay, I'm *really* getting off-topic for what's a Granby Tower thread -- my apologies -- but did you read the "Yellow Fever" series in the VA-Pilot? (It's on-topic in that it focused on DT Norfolk. )

I wasn't interested in the articles at all until my parents were so enamored of it. So, I read it, and it was amazing to me to consider how much an epidemic in the late 1800s so radically shaped what this area became for many decades.

Long story short, according to the series, many of the areas's best and brightest were killed, and the only way lots of people could make money was with prostitution and saloons, which, of course, is what Granby was known for in the 1930s, '40s, and beyond. Who's to say how Norfolk (and Portsmouth) might've been different if that plague hadn't occurred.

[Hampton Roads Off-Topic Talk]

I repectfully disagree on how Oceana will affect Norfolk's economy. Most of Oceanas core men live in Vabeach and spend their money in Vabeach. Remember I worked there and socialized with the people who were stationed there. Most of the contractors don't live in the area due to the govt. awarding so many contracts to different companies every so often to keep it fair. I think the Mayor of Vabeach asked for the support of the Norfolk mayor Fraim and its good to finally see the two mayors working together. I'm not saying that it will not affect the Vabeach economy because it most definitly will and that it will leave a hole in their economy. Most people around Oceana feel that Norfolk is too far to drive and stay in that area.

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Not to take this too far off-topic, but I'm curious on your perspective of where all the money is coming from to pay such enormous prices for real estate in this area. Although I'm in the R.E. business, most of my company's work is elsewhere, and I rarely interact with buyers anyway.

But when I look at job postings in this area, I don't see much that's really great-paying, yet there seems to be no shortage of moneyed buyers.

In fact, I would say there's a good chance that no one who lives in my building could buy at today's prices, other than the Oceana pilot -- who's the only one who paid anywhere close to what the units would fetch today.