GID
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Posts posted by GID
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Instead of a new thread I figured this would tie in best here
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/14/us/14streetcar.html
Nashville used to have street cars; one was routed from Percy Warner Park, down the median of the B. Meade Blvd, up West End to downtown. I always wished this could be returned.
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From the City Paper
http://www.nashvillecitypaper.com/news.php?viewStory=62085
IF I am going to be for this, I would want the May's to pay for the bridge and all intrastructure concerns. Also, since this is a clean slate how about going beyond LEED - rainwater collection, solar power use, perhaps wind tubines.
This could, almost, be a selfsustainable build
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There is another point to bring up; flood plane.
Is MTC in a flood plane or flood way? If so, the Corp and FEMA will have to sign off on this and that is a big hurdle. I know in Ashland City there are several pending lawsuits involving the City, FEMA and citizens over floodplane issues.
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Refinement: I think there has to be a difference between what is today considered "sprawl" and the more established speculative developments not considered "sprawl." Take downtown. At some point people crossed the river to live and to get away from town yet still be near their businesses. Then East Nashville burned, so many residents packed up and went upwind to a horse farm out west to build their mansions. Finally, to avoid bussing and forced integration, people moved even farther to get just over the county line. Of the establishments of East Nashville, Belle Meade and Brentwood, which are sprawl, if any, and why?
Sooo, I guess to the Indians when James Robertson showed up to build a log cabin on the Cumberland River it was sprawl to them?
I read somewhere where Nash still has over 100k zoned Ag...Starwood would have made a nice campus for MTC. How about the Fairgrounds? Stiner Lift (or whatever the metal place is downtown) We have touched on Metro Center.
I searched Realtracs.com for land within Davidson Co within 50-70 acres. There were seven shown, most expensive was 1.2M, least was 500k. I am sure there are more properties out there. Given this, MTC does not need to be placed where it is; if the whole objective is to bring HQ's, jobs and growth to compete with Cool Springs there are plenty of other places do build - intrastructure already in place, no bridge needed.
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First - a link to a story in todays Tennessean:
http://www.tennessean.com/apps/pbcs.dll/ar...T0301/807280319
Suzilla - MTC is advertised as being more upscale, corp HQ type of place. If you recall when MTC first advertised it linked in names like Belle Meade, West Meade, ave income within 5 miles, etc. Having the ONLY bridge directly to MTC coming from Cenntennial Blvd does not fit the "image" Yeah the prisioners are locked up but...still not too attractive entrance to the new downtown.
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I don't consider what I'm saying a slippery slope at all. I think what has happened over the past several decades provides substantiation to my statements.
Let's look at it this way. If Nashville does not come up with a truly attractive alternative to Cool Springs and other surburban office development areas, then we will most likely continue to see the the majority of new office, retail and housing developed outside Davidson County just as been happening for the last twenty years or so. I think few will argue that these surburban office developments contribute to sprawl in a big, big way. If Nashville were to be successful in attracting these companies back inside Davidson County, that would help put the breaks on this trend and help to reduce future sprawl. These companies are looking for value, and a high quality of life in the areas in which they locate. MTC can offer this, but downtown Nashville and areas near downtown may not. Costs will always be higher there, and crime and other inner city ills may always be a perceived threat, whether real or not.
Nashville has had locations to attracted HQ's in the past 20 yrs - Metro Center is the main one - some came, most left.
You mentioned "Value of life" and I would argue that Williamson Co offers much more than Davidson Co does (crime, schools, shopping)
Not only are compainies looking at a building to move into but what the County offers - Williamson Co is perceived to have much better schools than Davidson Co. What "incentives" does Williamson Co offer over Davidson Co?
Also, look at where the bridge might go - Cenntinnal Blvd - prisions and industry which may bring crime over or make the MTC less desirable to reach
I do not see this as simple as "build it they will come" type of mentality.
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If it gets built, it can't sprawl on the Bend if everything else is in conservation. I don't think that once conversation districts are created the are easily dismantled.
Throwing out the who will pay for this or that, could be used with every new development. If the county wasn't a consolidated government and Scottsboro were an incorporated city, folks there would be dealing with how to increase tax revenue and such to pay for services.
Has Mr May turned over the rest of the land to a conservation? IMO if MTC gets built the extra land he owns surrounding the build will eventually be developed.
Also, what about all the vacant business property already downtown? (ATT is 1/2 empty now) and business leaving downtown to move to MTC (80% of moved business are internal to Davidson Co - 20% come from outside) so would business just be moving from one plot to another?
Metro is trying to pay for a Convention Center downtown - how can they expect to pay for schools, police, etc in MTC?
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Todays Tennessean:
http://www.tennessean.com/apps/pbcs.dll/ar...S0202/807240363
I am still not for this
I do not buy into the May spin on keeping areas rural - if built it will sprawl and nothing can stop it.
Who will build the schools, fire / police halls, etc?
Metro Center would be a nice HQ location for a company
There are way too many unknowns on this
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A very nice video - granted it is very one sided. Nice use of birds and green grass blowing in the wind
I thought MTC was geared toward the Belle Meade folks, in the video the state the MTC will help growth on Trinity Lane and Dickerson Rd (huh?)
I went for a motorcycle ride yesterday - there are plenty of spaces downtown to build a 4B development - the area below Jefferson St / Bicen Mall / Downtown - there are some new condos there but still block after block is underdeveloped. Intrastructure is in place, close to downtown, next door to a Park
We drove my TSU - I didnt know there was a large goat farm across the street. That is in Davidson Co, why not there?
If MTC is going to align itself w. the development of Dickerson Rd then a goat farm would be ok for development
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In today's Nashville Scene the cover story is about MTC (I would have posted a link but the Scene's website is behind their print copy)
The author covers both sides fairly and what could / might happen.
If MTC does not get passed the current zoning does allow for 600+ residences to be build on the May property. This would be better than 40k folks going in and out on ONE bridge.
Who will pay the 100M for the bridge and Brilery Pkwy work? Who pays for the services (school, fire, etc) for the residences?
Also - I found very interesting, most companies do not come from outside the area to relocate (20% or so) while most are from the County already. ie - what is to be gained if the MTC is built and then the vast majority of tenants move from other areas of Davidson Co?
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"the greater good of Nashville..."
Why not build up instead of out? How about Ellington Pkwy, Dickerson Rd, Madison - close to downtown, space available, interstructure in place - 4B would build a very nice center there.
A bridge would remove HOMEOWNERS from, well, their homes. (Can someone start a Thread on what Metro is trying to do w. the Joy property on Music Row??)
Some will bring up added tax revenue - I can bring up wasted tax spending
I am for good growth but IMO I do not think Bells Bend area is a good area for this. I feel Mr. May is just looking for something he can put his name on.
I do understand this forum is geared to folks wanting buildings, concrete, expansion of a City, etc. Can anyone see once this land is gone it is gone forever. I do appreciate you allowing the other side to be heard
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I hope this does not get built.
Nashville does not need this - why not focus on rebuilting blighted areas (Antioch, 4th Ave - the area between downtown and I-40 on the South side, etc, etc, etc)
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could you please explain? not sure if i'm following.
I think he means, is this growth really necessary?
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these areas don't really fit the requirement of may town center. the site they have it planned on now would not involve demolition of existing buildings and moving of existing companies. and how does one just simply "remove the crime?". i think we have a police chief that would be thrilled to have access to that information. building here allows the developer to design the whole area as they like, incorporating many different features in it that might be cost prohibitive in other areas (such as metro center and 4th and layfette. they can design it to be more user friendly, thus more attractive to companies wanting to move. in a case like this more buildings IS the answer. and to respond to the government having to spend money on the project. you have to spend money to make money. the goal should be long term. how much money is bells bend making the government right now?
Is making money the real and only point to all of this?
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there is no such thing as a rural area in a city. rural areas exist outside of the city. i understand the point you are trying to make, but i feel it could be better used through the proposal that has been made with may town center. if you use the fact of locally grown veggies being a positive for this city, would that be better than the tax money that will come from the new development?
The taxes raised are all based on MTC figures. How many millions will the Govt have to kick in for a private development (Bridge, interstructure, etc) I think the 100M the Govt will be paying maybe better spent elsewhere.
Why not reclaim 4th & Layfette area of downtown - remove the crime and build MTC there. Metro Center is another.
Why do people think more buildings is the answer?
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I think it's absurd to expect an area along the river just a few miles for the center of a metropolitan area of more than 1.5 Million residents, and an area that will surely exceed 2 Million residents by 2020, to never get crowded. Eventually, it's going to happen, period.
That is the point this area does not have to be developed, there are many other areas of town underutilized. Why not keep ONE area of a city rural? 75% of produce that Nashville consumed was grown/raised in this area, now we import from overseas (check your veggies, not all are USA grown)
Why not use an area to support the arg needs of a city?
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Grapa,
When and where will the meeting be held?
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The only person who wants this and owns land in the area is Mr. May. I live close and do not want another 50k commuters and the added trash / waste dumped in the river.
Add this to the H2O development and that neck of the woods just got very crowded
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I keep hoping this development will just die or go away as so many others do.
It is a massive project.
I was on the Cumberland in my little sailboat last night; a eagle was flying around looking for its dinner. Just very quiet and peaceful.
Nashville has other areas that are in need of restoration / developement - can one area of a City not be kept rural?
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"Add to the nuances that the are clear cutting and surveying on the interstate easement at Thunderbird Drive, and there is a zoning change sign up in front of the Waffle House where Cabot (? does it change names?) meets Charlotte just a block or so east of Walmart."
I think the zoning sign relates to the H2O development. The tree cutting along the interstate is (IMO) to prevent large trees from falling into the interstate.
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Grapa
I live across the river from Bells Bend.
Just wondering, is there any type of development the majority of landowners would support?
It seems at some point something will be developed in the "Bend".
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So looking at those aerial pictures, is the H2O development in that heavily treed area in the left foreground? If so, I'm surprised by the amount of built-up area around it.
Walmart's roof is in the lower left in the photos. H2O will be to the RIGHT of Walmart / Lowes shopping center.
If you look to the LEFT of Walmart you will see two wooded hills. This is where Zeitlen (sp) was going to build the tall condo tower w. a walking bridge across the Cumberland - which he passed on to try and build the residences in Bells Bend, which the community voted down.
If you look to the LEFT of the two wooded hills and along the river you can barely see a dead end road and a few houses. This is where I live - 11 houses total on the Street.
Here is some food for thought - the 200+ acres along the river to the LEFT of our home is owned by Al Gainer (yes, same guy who was part of the Sunquist administration and found guilty of destroying edvidence - his "company" was the only bidder for a 100M Govt bid to put internet in schools) I met him, and I do not at all trust him.
I can see his land being sold off at some point
ps - a little off topic, my apology.
Rumor has it a CVS pharmacy is going to be placed on the corner of Charlotte and Davidson. This would be the Exxon station or the playground of the elementry school
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Concerning interstructure - Harpeth Valley Utilities is right next door (They are doing another expansion to their facilities, again) So tapping into treated water and waste disposal is not an issue at all.
I would assume I would be able to see the taller buildings from my back yard.
MTC needs to land a few Corp HQ's prior to build
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This may be just what Nashville and Davidson County needs to stem the tide of Corporate Headquarter locations in outlying counties. This could also have a pronounced effect of reducing future urban sprawl in the area. I hope this project gains traction.
What about Metro Center (which was built on the North side of town about 20 yrs ago)? Wasnt this supposed to be Class A Corp center, etc, etc...now its pretty much a waste land.
H2O will be (hopefully) on the opposite side of the river, downstream about 1/2 mile.
I am beginning to have mixed feeling about the May development - too much, too concrete? I would like to see a video of the development.
May Town Center
in Nashville
Posted
http://www.tennessean.com/apps/pbcs.dll/ar...S0202/808150415
The decision is in....lets put off making a decision